Comments on: It’s pointless to fear the power of myth in the movies http://sluggerotoole.com/2009/04/14/its-pointless-to-fear-the-power-of-myth-in-the-movies/ Conversation, politics and stray insights Sun, 27 May 2012 03:59:19 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.2 By: latcheeco http://sluggerotoole.com/2009/04/14/its-pointless-to-fear-the-power-of-myth-in-the-movies/comment-page-2/#comment-309584 latcheeco Sat, 18 Apr 2009 11:22:24 +0000 #comment-309584 Chris, But isn't it equally arguable that you're being revisionist because constitutional nationalists like Redmond could, in 1916, say the same thing as you're saying now, given the Home Rule Act was passed (albeit postponed till after the war). They also had a constitutional compromise in which the majority chose to locally administer British rule. They also insisted, as you do, that this meant the nightmare was over. Indeed they believed in it so much that they were off in the trenches getting slaughtered by the thousand. Chris,
But isn’t it equally arguable that you’re being revisionist because constitutional nationalists like Redmond could, in 1916, say the same thing as you’re saying now, given the Home Rule Act was passed (albeit postponed till after the war). They also had a constitutional compromise in which the majority chose to locally administer British rule. They also insisted, as you do, that this meant the nightmare was over. Indeed they believed in it so much that they were off in the trenches getting slaughtered by the thousand.

]]> By: Greenflag http://sluggerotoole.com/2009/04/14/its-pointless-to-fear-the-power-of-myth-in-the-movies/comment-page-2/#comment-309201 Greenflag Thu, 16 Apr 2009 23:57:59 +0000 #comment-309201 uhu 'What’s the Irish flag represent? ' It seemed like a good idea at the time. We can still keep the tricolour post repartition and the 'orange ' can represent the present minority in the Republic and also the unionists of those areas of the present NI which would be ceded the Republic. . Presumably a smaller mainly Unionist State would recognise their 10 to 20% Nationalist minority by giving it a spot on their new flag . I'd suggest a reverse of the Irish tricolour but alas that option has apparently been taken up by the Ivory Coast :( uhu

‘What’s the Irish flag represent? ‘

It seemed like a good idea at the time. We can still keep the tricolour post repartition and the ‘orange ‘ can represent the present minority in the Republic and also the unionists of those areas of the present NI which would be ceded the Republic. . Presumably a smaller mainly Unionist State would recognise their 10 to 20% Nationalist minority by giving it a spot on their new flag . I’d suggest a reverse of the Irish tricolour but alas that option has apparently been taken up by the Ivory Coast :(

]]> By: UHU http://sluggerotoole.com/2009/04/14/its-pointless-to-fear-the-power-of-myth-in-the-movies/comment-page-2/#comment-309184 UHU Thu, 16 Apr 2009 22:25:46 +0000 #comment-309184 Repartition it is then. Let the Greens stay south and the Orange remain North. What's the Irish flag represent? Repartition it is then.

Let the Greens stay south and the Orange remain North.

What’s the Irish flag represent?

]]> By: Greenflag http://sluggerotoole.com/2009/04/14/its-pointless-to-fear-the-power-of-myth-in-the-movies/comment-page-2/#comment-309089 Greenflag Thu, 16 Apr 2009 15:39:55 +0000 #comment-309089 Repartition is the way forward when this Assembly implodes. We'll never agree on the past and it's unlikely we'll agree on the future . Que sera and all that . Cast a cold eye on all the dead heroes and victims on all sides and just move on . Repartition is the way forward when this Assembly implodes. We’ll never agree on the past and it’s unlikely we’ll agree on the future . Que sera and all that . Cast a cold eye on all the dead heroes and victims on all sides and just move on .

]]> By: HeadTheBall http://sluggerotoole.com/2009/04/14/its-pointless-to-fear-the-power-of-myth-in-the-movies/comment-page-2/#comment-309063 HeadTheBall Thu, 16 Apr 2009 05:45:44 +0000 #comment-309063 "entirely the fault" I never attributed blame, and certainly not in the categorical sense you imply. On the other hand I suspect that by "the injustices of the past" you mean those perpetrated by one "side" only, viz. "themmuns". “entirely the fault”

I never attributed blame, and certainly not in the categorical sense you imply. On the other hand I suspect that by “the injustices of the past” you mean those perpetrated by one “side” only, viz. “themmuns”.

]]> By: T.R.O.H.V.M http://sluggerotoole.com/2009/04/14/its-pointless-to-fear-the-power-of-myth-in-the-movies/comment-page-2/#comment-309059 T.R.O.H.V.M Thu, 16 Apr 2009 05:04:55 +0000 #comment-309059 'I have been trying to address the situation we face in NI today' Your words. To do that, you need to address the injustices of the past. Of which partition was one. You brought up alienation of the unionist community, as if it were entirely the fault of the other side ! ‘I have been trying to address the situation we face in NI today’

Your words. To do that, you need to address the injustices of the past. Of which partition was one. You brought up alienation of the unionist community, as if it were entirely the fault of the other side !

]]> By: HeadTheBall http://sluggerotoole.com/2009/04/14/its-pointless-to-fear-the-power-of-myth-in-the-movies/comment-page-2/#comment-309058 HeadTheBall Thu, 16 Apr 2009 05:00:50 +0000 #comment-309058 Brian, Hear! Hear! T.R.O.H.V.M Words in mouth, mo chara. I never said that the past has "absolutlely nothing" to do with where we are today. Rather, my problem with you is that you want to talk about "absolutlely nothing" but the past. Oíche mhaith. Brian,

Hear! Hear!

T.R.O.H.V.M

Words in mouth, mo chara. I never said that the past has “absolutlely nothing” to do with where we are today. Rather, my problem with you is that you want to talk about “absolutlely nothing” but the past.

Oíche mhaith.

]]> By: Brian MacAodh http://sluggerotoole.com/2009/04/14/its-pointless-to-fear-the-power-of-myth-in-the-movies/comment-page-2/#comment-309055 Brian MacAodh Thu, 16 Apr 2009 04:38:02 +0000 #comment-309055 The fact that there never should have been partition in the first place doesn't change anything. We have to deal with the realities of the situation in the north today and find a way to make it work. The fact that there never should have been partition in the first place doesn’t change anything. We have to deal with the realities of the situation in the north today and find a way to make it work.

]]> By: T.R.O.H.V.M http://sluggerotoole.com/2009/04/14/its-pointless-to-fear-the-power-of-myth-in-the-movies/comment-page-2/#comment-309053 T.R.O.H.V.M Thu, 16 Apr 2009 04:24:56 +0000 #comment-309053 Ahh so the past has absolutlely nothing to do with the situation in the north today. Right...ok..... thanks for clearing that up ! Ahh so the past has absolutlely nothing to do with the situation in the north today. Right…ok….. thanks for clearing that up !

]]> By: HeadTheBall http://sluggerotoole.com/2009/04/14/its-pointless-to-fear-the-power-of-myth-in-the-movies/comment-page-2/#comment-309050 HeadTheBall Thu, 16 Apr 2009 03:54:05 +0000 #comment-309050 My bad. There I go interrupting your nice wallow in Mopery. I have been trying to address the situation we face in NI today but if you prefer a nice rant about the injustices of the past, please be my guest. Enjoy. My bad. There I go interrupting your nice wallow in Mopery.

I have been trying to address the situation we face in NI today but if you prefer a nice rant about the injustices of the past, please be my guest.

Enjoy.

]]> By: T.R.O.H.V.M http://sluggerotoole.com/2009/04/14/its-pointless-to-fear-the-power-of-myth-in-the-movies/comment-page-2/#comment-309047 T.R.O.H.V.M Thu, 16 Apr 2009 03:41:26 +0000 #comment-309047 'Looking across the water to some assumed tribal cousins is not unique to NI.' So to demand the partition of Ireland was merely 'looking across the water' was it. Thats great to know....any other pearls of wisdom? ‘Looking across the water to some assumed tribal cousins is not unique to NI.’

So to demand the partition of Ireland was merely ‘looking across the water’ was it. Thats great to know….any other pearls of wisdom?

]]> By: HeadTheBall http://sluggerotoole.com/2009/04/14/its-pointless-to-fear-the-power-of-myth-in-the-movies/comment-page-2/#comment-309046 HeadTheBall Thu, 16 Apr 2009 03:35:16 +0000 #comment-309046 Really on form there! "prior to partition" was getting on for a century ago FFS. I have much to learn from you though. In that single phrase ("prior to partition") you have managed to conflate the unemployed Shankill Road Prod of today with the Big House unionists of the late 19thC. Masterly, absolutely masterly. Really on form there!

“prior to partition” was getting on for a century ago FFS.

I have much to learn from you though. In that single phrase (“prior to partition”) you have managed to conflate the unemployed Shankill Road Prod of today with the Big House unionists of the late 19thC.

Masterly, absolutely masterly.

]]> By: HeadTheBall http://sluggerotoole.com/2009/04/14/its-pointless-to-fear-the-power-of-myth-in-the-movies/comment-page-2/#comment-309044 HeadTheBall Thu, 16 Apr 2009 03:29:28 +0000 #comment-309044 And as to your Italian Americans, ever heard of ENOSIS? Looking across the water to some assumed tribal cousins is not unique to NI. I am not saying that it is either good or right but simply lampooning it, as you do, won't make it go away. And as to your Italian Americans, ever heard of ENOSIS?

Looking across the water to some assumed tribal cousins is not unique to NI. I am not saying that it is either good or right but simply lampooning it, as you do, won’t make it go away.

]]> By: T.R.O.H.V.M http://sluggerotoole.com/2009/04/14/its-pointless-to-fear-the-power-of-myth-in-the-movies/comment-page-2/#comment-309043 T.R.O.H.V.M Thu, 16 Apr 2009 03:28:45 +0000 #comment-309043 'Too alienated'???? Ahh so it was ailenation which forced unionists to deny the democratic will of the irish people for so long prior to partition. Right gotcha ! It was themmuns fault. This 'ailenation' wouldn't have anything to do with the manner in which history has placed unionists (Buffer)? The blame for that lies at the feet of the irish who should just have rolled over and took john Bulls pork sword like good little savages....doesn't it? ‘Too alienated’????

Ahh so it was ailenation which forced unionists to deny the democratic will of the irish people for so long prior to partition. Right gotcha !
It was themmuns fault.

This ‘ailenation’ wouldn’t have anything to do with the manner in which history has placed unionists (Buffer)? The blame for that lies at the feet of the irish who should just have rolled over and took john Bulls pork sword like good little savages….doesn’t it?

]]> By: HeadTheBall http://sluggerotoole.com/2009/04/14/its-pointless-to-fear-the-power-of-myth-in-the-movies/comment-page-2/#comment-309039 HeadTheBall Thu, 16 Apr 2009 03:12:15 +0000 #comment-309039 Actually, instead of “too good” or “too scared” try "too alienated", then reflect whether your own kind of thinking might not contribute to that. Actually, instead of “too good” or “too scared” try “too alienated”, then reflect whether your own kind of thinking might not contribute to that.

]]> By: HeadTheBall http://sluggerotoole.com/2009/04/14/its-pointless-to-fear-the-power-of-myth-in-the-movies/comment-page-2/#comment-309037 HeadTheBall Thu, 16 Apr 2009 03:10:08 +0000 #comment-309037 It’s your own emotive language that’s causing the problem. You link the idea of military occupation to the unionist community. Military occupation is almost invariably illegal, ergo occupiers should be evicted. That may all be logical enough, but gets us nowhere with our little local difficulties. You’re at it again in your last post with your “too good” and “savage natives”. Maybe “too scared” would be more true and are you characterizing John Hume and Gerry Adams, for example, with their fine Scots and English surnames as “natives”. And do you think most Catholics are savage or do you just assume Prods think that way? It’s your own emotive language that’s causing the problem. You link the idea of military occupation to the unionist community. Military occupation is almost invariably illegal, ergo occupiers should be evicted. That may all be logical enough, but gets us nowhere with our little local difficulties.

You’re at it again in your last post with your “too good” and “savage natives”. Maybe “too scared” would be more true and are you characterizing John Hume and Gerry Adams, for example, with their fine Scots and English surnames as “natives”. And do you think most Catholics are savage or do you just assume Prods think that way?

]]> By: T.R.O.H.V.M http://sluggerotoole.com/2009/04/14/its-pointless-to-fear-the-power-of-myth-in-the-movies/comment-page-2/#comment-309015 T.R.O.H.V.M Thu, 16 Apr 2009 01:58:06 +0000 #comment-309015 'Aha, so you see the “loyal minority” as occupiers, do you. So what do you want them to do: Withdraw? No dice, they’ve been here, some of them, longer than you.' Who said anything about anyone having to 'upsticks'? You seem to imply words which are not there and were never said. However I don't see too many Italian Americans demanding Rome rule part of the US eastern seaboard however do you? Our 'Ulster-scots' brethern are too good to live in a land governed by savage natives though aren't they? ‘Aha, so you see the “loyal minority” as occupiers, do you. So what do you want them to do:

Withdraw? No dice, they’ve been here, some of them, longer than you.’

Who said anything about anyone having to ‘upsticks’? You seem to imply words which are not there and were never said.

However I don’t see too many Italian Americans
demanding Rome rule part of the US eastern seaboard however do you? Our ‘Ulster-scots’ brethern are too good to live in a land governed by savage natives though aren’t they?

]]> By: Greagoir O' Franclin http://sluggerotoole.com/2009/04/14/its-pointless-to-fear-the-power-of-myth-in-the-movies/comment-page-2/#comment-308940 Greagoir O' Franclin Wed, 15 Apr 2009 17:46:17 +0000 #comment-308940 ha ha ...good one Rory, very funny! :-) ha ha …good one Rory, very funny!
:-)

]]> By: Greenflag http://sluggerotoole.com/2009/04/14/its-pointless-to-fear-the-power-of-myth-in-the-movies/comment-page-2/#comment-308927 Greenflag Wed, 15 Apr 2009 16:51:48 +0000 #comment-308927 Fin , Northern Ireland economist Smyth seems to think the 'union' has been good for the Irish economy as in todays paper Mr Smyth said the southern influence on the Northern Ireland property market is just one part of a wider trend. “So much of Northern Ireland’s industry is owned by southern companies or companies based in the south,’’ he said. “Virtually every bank in Northern Ireland is southern owned, whole swathes of our economy are now southern owned. “I don’t think people should be afraid of this. “If the situations were reversed we would be buying up huge swathes of the Republic.” Can't see the Pound sterling going anywhere except 'down' so Mr Smyth's if is a very big IF . The 'bad side ' of the above is that the Irish Government through it's bailout of toxic debts may soon own large tracts of 'developing ' parts of Belfast (Shankill) albeit temporarily . Fin ,

Northern Ireland economist Smyth seems to think the ‘union’ has been good for the Irish economy as in todays paper

Mr Smyth said the southern influence on the Northern Ireland property market is just one part of a wider trend.

“So much of Northern Ireland’s industry is owned by southern companies or companies based in the south,’’ he said.

“Virtually every bank in Northern Ireland is southern owned, whole swathes of our economy are now southern owned.

“I don’t think people should be afraid of this.

“If the situations were reversed we would be buying up huge swathes of the Republic.”

Can’t see the Pound sterling going anywhere except ‘down’ so Mr Smyth’s if is a very big IF .

The ‘bad side ‘ of the above is that the Irish Government through it’s bailout of toxic debts may soon own large tracts of ‘developing ‘ parts of Belfast (Shankill) albeit temporarily .

]]> By: Rory Carr http://sluggerotoole.com/2009/04/14/its-pointless-to-fear-the-power-of-myth-in-the-movies/comment-page-2/#comment-308925 Rory Carr Wed, 15 Apr 2009 16:41:23 +0000 #comment-308925 The main problem with portraying Loyalist gangs in a positive light in Hollywood movies is in making them appealing to a mainstream audience as is indicated by this clip, a dramatic reconstruction of an RUC interrogation of Johnny Adair, from an unfinished movie intended to highlight their heroic exploits: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cK28__Yk0tY&feature=PlayList&p=82D959BDAD01BAB2&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=3 The main problem with portraying Loyalist gangs in a positive light in Hollywood movies is in making them appealing to a mainstream audience as is indicated by this clip, a dramatic reconstruction of an RUC interrogation of Johnny Adair, from an unfinished movie intended to highlight their heroic exploits:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cK28__Yk0tY&feature=PlayList&p=82D959BDAD01BAB2&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=3

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