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	<title>Comments on: &#8220;As of yet there is no date actually agreed by the politicians..&#8221;</title>
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	<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/11/19/as-of-yet-there-is-no-date-actually-agreed-by-the-politicians/</link>
	<description>Conversation, politics and stray insights</description>
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		<title>By: Ian</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/11/19/as-of-yet-there-is-no-date-actually-agreed-by-the-politicians/comment-page-1/#comment-277198</link>
		<dc:creator>Ian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Nov 2008 19:40:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-277198</guid>
		<description>&quot;I’m confident to put my neck on the line and say that the SDLP will get the job.&quot;

If that&#039;s to be the case, the timing of the European elections may impact on the timing of devolution.  The SDLP&#039;s preferred Justice Minister may well be Alban Maguinness, but he&#039;s also their candidate for Europe.  Am I right in thinking that he can&#039;t be a Minister in the Executive and an MEP at the same time?

But if the Justice post is assigned next spring, he wouldn&#039;t want to turn it down and then maybe not end up elected in Europe either?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I’m confident to put my neck on the line and say that the SDLP will get the job.&#8221;</p>
<p>If that&#8217;s to be the case, the timing of the European elections may impact on the timing of devolution.  The SDLP&#8217;s preferred Justice Minister may well be Alban Maguinness, but he&#8217;s also their candidate for Europe.  Am I right in thinking that he can&#8217;t be a Minister in the Executive and an MEP at the same time?</p>
<p>But if the Justice post is assigned next spring, he wouldn&#8217;t want to turn it down and then maybe not end up elected in Europe either?</p>
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		<title>By: Lamaria</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/11/19/as-of-yet-there-is-no-date-actually-agreed-by-the-politicians/comment-page-1/#comment-276940</link>
		<dc:creator>Lamaria</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Nov 2008 21:04:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-276940</guid>
		<description>Comrade Stalin, I&#039;ve noticed a subtle change in Sinn Féin&#039;s attitude to the SDLP getting the ministerial position since the announcement.  Take McGuinness for example when asked if Sinn Féin would now support a minister drawn from the ranks of the SDLP he stated: &quot;I very much have an open mind about that.&quot;

I&#039;m confident to put my neck on the line and say that the SDLP will get the job.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Comrade Stalin, I&#8217;ve noticed a subtle change in Sinn Féin&#8217;s attitude to the SDLP getting the ministerial position since the announcement.  Take McGuinness for example when asked if Sinn Féin would now support a minister drawn from the ranks of the SDLP he stated: &#8220;I very much have an open mind about that.&#8221;</p>
<p>I&#8217;m confident to put my neck on the line and say that the SDLP will get the job.</p>
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		<title>By: runciter</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/11/19/as-of-yet-there-is-no-date-actually-agreed-by-the-politicians/comment-page-1/#comment-276868</link>
		<dc:creator>runciter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Nov 2008 13:15:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-276868</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;The SDLP’s bluster about d’Hondt was just that. There is no legislation right now that determines exactly how the minister is appointed. If it were to be a d’Hondt appointment, the SDLP would not automatically be in the driving seat - the d’Hondt process would be re-run from the top and either Sinn Fein or the DUP would take it.&lt;/i&gt;

Hardly bluster, since the decision to not use D&#039;Hondt means that Nationalists are effectively being denied an additional ministry. SF&#039;s performance in this matter has been little short of treacherous. Hypocritical too, if one takes into account their recent attempts to paint Durkan as being anti-power sharing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>The SDLP’s bluster about d’Hondt was just that. There is no legislation right now that determines exactly how the minister is appointed. If it were to be a d’Hondt appointment, the SDLP would not automatically be in the driving seat &#8211; the d’Hondt process would be re-run from the top and either Sinn Fein or the DUP would take it.</i></p>
<p>Hardly bluster, since the decision to not use D&#8217;Hondt means that Nationalists are effectively being denied an additional ministry. SF&#8217;s performance in this matter has been little short of treacherous. Hypocritical too, if one takes into account their recent attempts to paint Durkan as being anti-power sharing.</p>
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		<title>By: Comrade Stalin</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/11/19/as-of-yet-there-is-no-date-actually-agreed-by-the-politicians/comment-page-1/#comment-276832</link>
		<dc:creator>Comrade Stalin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Nov 2008 23:42:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-276832</guid>
		<description>&lt;I&gt;I haven’t heard the SDLP mention d’hondt once since it was confirmed that a new Minister would be elected by cross-community Assembly vote.  Perhaps they are now in pole position for the new Justice Ministry, rather than Alliance? &lt;/I&gt;

Sinn Fein do not want the SDLP or the DUP to have the ministry, and the DUP do not want the UUP or Sinn Fein to have the ministry. Hence Alliance are in the frame, and as far as I know this hasn&#039;t changed. 

The SDLP&#039;s bluster about d&#039;Hondt was just that. There is no legislation right now that determines exactly how the minister is appointed. If it were to be a d&#039;Hondt appointment, the SDLP would not automatically be in the driving seat - the d&#039;Hondt process would be re-run from the top and either Sinn Fein or the DUP would take it. This seems academic, since the latest proposals say it will be a cross-community vote which essentially means that SF and the DUP control the outcome jointly.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>I haven’t heard the SDLP mention d’hondt once since it was confirmed that a new Minister would be elected by cross-community Assembly vote.  Perhaps they are now in pole position for the new Justice Ministry, rather than Alliance? </i></p>
<p>Sinn Fein do not want the SDLP or the DUP to have the ministry, and the DUP do not want the UUP or Sinn Fein to have the ministry. Hence Alliance are in the frame, and as far as I know this hasn&#8217;t changed. </p>
<p>The SDLP&#8217;s bluster about d&#8217;Hondt was just that. There is no legislation right now that determines exactly how the minister is appointed. If it were to be a d&#8217;Hondt appointment, the SDLP would not automatically be in the driving seat &#8211; the d&#8217;Hondt process would be re-run from the top and either Sinn Fein or the DUP would take it. This seems academic, since the latest proposals say it will be a cross-community vote which essentially means that SF and the DUP control the outcome jointly.</p>
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		<title>By: ulsterfan</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/11/19/as-of-yet-there-is-no-date-actually-agreed-by-the-politicians/comment-page-1/#comment-276814</link>
		<dc:creator>ulsterfan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Nov 2008 22:10:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-276814</guid>
		<description>Gerry&#039;s next performance at the Ard Feis will be interesting about P&amp;J;and the date he gave last year.
Perhaps he needs a good spin doctor -----is Mr Powell still about?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Gerry&#8217;s next performance at the Ard Feis will be interesting about P&#038;J;and the date he gave last year.<br />
Perhaps he needs a good spin doctor &#8212;&#8211;is Mr Powell still about?</p>
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		<title>By: josephine</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/11/19/as-of-yet-there-is-no-date-actually-agreed-by-the-politicians/comment-page-1/#comment-276809</link>
		<dc:creator>josephine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Nov 2008 21:31:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-276809</guid>
		<description>i ask again: where is sammy mcnally hiding? or is &#039;billy&#039; just sammy in mufti?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i ask again: where is sammy mcnally hiding? or is &#8216;billy&#8217; just sammy in mufti?</p>
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		<title>By: Granni Trixie</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/11/19/as-of-yet-there-is-no-date-actually-agreed-by-the-politicians/comment-page-1/#comment-276769</link>
		<dc:creator>Granni Trixie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Nov 2008 18:52:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-276769</guid>
		<description>Pete: You are right in identifying that (unlike USA) I was not directing my conspiracy theory in your direction.So apoplogies to you if my remarks looked like that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Pete: You are right in identifying that (unlike USA) I was not directing my conspiracy theory in your direction.So apoplogies to you if my remarks looked like that.</p>
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		<title>By: Lamaria</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/11/19/as-of-yet-there-is-no-date-actually-agreed-by-the-politicians/comment-page-1/#comment-276754</link>
		<dc:creator>Lamaria</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Nov 2008 17:34:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-276754</guid>
		<description>I haven&#039;t heard the SDLP mention d&#039;hondt once since it was confirmed that a new Minister would be elected by cross-community Assembly vote.  Perhaps they are now in pole position for the new Justice Ministry, rather than Alliance?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I haven&#8217;t heard the SDLP mention d&#8217;hondt once since it was confirmed that a new Minister would be elected by cross-community Assembly vote.  Perhaps they are now in pole position for the new Justice Ministry, rather than Alliance?</p>
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		<title>By: Pete Baker</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/11/19/as-of-yet-there-is-no-date-actually-agreed-by-the-politicians/comment-page-1/#comment-276746</link>
		<dc:creator>Pete Baker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Nov 2008 17:07:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-276746</guid>
		<description>Granni Trixie

I hope you&#039;re not thinking entirely the same thing?  ;o)

I&#039;ve checked with Mick.

He&#039;s temporarily closed that post until he&#039;s had time to check a small legal matter arising from one of the comments.

Slugger Central is currently off-line but he should be back later today.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Granni Trixie</p>
<p>I hope you&#8217;re not thinking entirely the same thing?  ;o)</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve checked with Mick.</p>
<p>He&#8217;s temporarily closed that post until he&#8217;s had time to check a small legal matter arising from one of the comments.</p>
<p>Slugger Central is currently off-line but he should be back later today.</p>
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		<title>By: edward</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/11/19/as-of-yet-there-is-no-date-actually-agreed-by-the-politicians/comment-page-1/#comment-276739</link>
		<dc:creator>edward</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Nov 2008 16:48:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-276739</guid>
		<description>If that was the case, why aren’t they promoting the exclusion of a Shinner from the office of Justice Minister until 2012 as a “four year decontamination period”? That’s what it amounts to, after all. 

Posted by Dave

Because they also promoted the exclusion of a Duper from the office as well</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If that was the case, why aren’t they promoting the exclusion of a Shinner from the office of Justice Minister until 2012 as a “four year decontamination period”? That’s what it amounts to, after all. </p>
<p>Posted by Dave</p>
<p>Because they also promoted the exclusion of a Duper from the office as well</p>
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		<title>By: Granni Trixie</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/11/19/as-of-yet-there-is-no-date-actually-agreed-by-the-politicians/comment-page-1/#comment-276735</link>
		<dc:creator>Granni Trixie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Nov 2008 16:37:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-276735</guid>
		<description>USA:I was thinking the same thing: a poor outlook if views on the first AT in NI have to be censored. 
I posted general comments/posed questions here on the subject which I feel sure are not libelous. 
What&#039;s going on?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>USA:I was thinking the same thing: a poor outlook if views on the first AT in NI have to be censored.<br />
I posted general comments/posed questions here on the subject which I feel sure are not libelous.<br />
What&#8217;s going on?</p>
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		<title>By: Granni Trixie</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/11/19/as-of-yet-there-is-no-date-actually-agreed-by-the-politicians/comment-page-1/#comment-276734</link>
		<dc:creator>Granni Trixie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Nov 2008 16:37:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-276734</guid>
		<description>USA:I was thinking the same thing: a poor outlook if views on the first AT in NI have to be censored. 
I posted general comments/posed questions here on the subject which I feel sure are not libelous. 
What&#039;s going on?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>USA:I was thinking the same thing: a poor outlook if views on the first AT in NI have to be censored.<br />
I posted general comments/posed questions here on the subject which I feel sure are not libelous.<br />
What&#8217;s going on?</p>
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		<title>By: Grassy Noel</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/11/19/as-of-yet-there-is-no-date-actually-agreed-by-the-politicians/comment-page-1/#comment-276730</link>
		<dc:creator>Grassy Noel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Nov 2008 16:17:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-276730</guid>
		<description>Er, what happened to Fair Deal&#039;s thread on this from yesterday?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Er, what happened to Fair Deal&#8217;s thread on this from yesterday?</p>
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		<title>By: Reader</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/11/19/as-of-yet-there-is-no-date-actually-agreed-by-the-politicians/comment-page-1/#comment-276728</link>
		<dc:creator>Reader</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Nov 2008 16:11:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-276728</guid>
		<description>Billy: &lt;i&gt;I was talking to my friends and family (as I no longer live in the North) and they were saying that they couldn&#8217;t remember the last time that they saw a British soldier.&lt;/i&gt;&lt;br&gt;
But how would they know? Last time I saw my Brother in law he was in a morning suit. The time before that he was in jeans.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Billy: <i>I was talking to my friends and family (as I no longer live in the North) and they were saying that they couldn&#8217;t remember the last time that they saw a British soldier.</i><br />
But how would they know? Last time I saw my Brother in law he was in a morning suit. The time before that he was in jeans.</p>
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		<title>By: Comrade Stalin</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/11/19/as-of-yet-there-is-no-date-actually-agreed-by-the-politicians/comment-page-1/#comment-276713</link>
		<dc:creator>Comrade Stalin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Nov 2008 14:01:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-276713</guid>
		<description>&lt;I&gt;There is no way that Robinson could have come out with a definite date - it would have been a Godsend to the TUV.&lt;/I&gt;

Billy, I&#039;m not really inclined to reply to your posts since whenever I do you just ignore me, but I think it&#039;s wonderful that you have backed down over the May deadline in the belief that you need to do so to secure Robinson&#039;s position. 

Something for you to ponder. Do you think that Robinson would have moved on policing and justice powers to help secure the position of Gerry or Martin ?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>There is no way that Robinson could have come out with a definite date &#8211; it would have been a Godsend to the TUV.</i></p>
<p>Billy, I&#8217;m not really inclined to reply to your posts since whenever I do you just ignore me, but I think it&#8217;s wonderful that you have backed down over the May deadline in the belief that you need to do so to secure Robinson&#8217;s position. </p>
<p>Something for you to ponder. Do you think that Robinson would have moved on policing and justice powers to help secure the position of Gerry or Martin ?</p>
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		<title>By: Dave</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/11/19/as-of-yet-there-is-no-date-actually-agreed-by-the-politicians/comment-page-1/#comment-276706</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Nov 2008 09:25:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-276706</guid>
		<description>&quot;Who really believes that if the DUPers saw this as a clear and unambiguous victory we wouldnt be treated to the spectacle of dodds ab robbo doing the chicken dance in the chamber at storomont? &quot; - edward

If that was the case, why aren&#039;t they promoting the exclusion of a Shinner from the office of Justice Minister until 2012 as a &quot;four year decontamination period&quot;? That&#039;s what it amounts to, after all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Who really believes that if the DUPers saw this as a clear and unambiguous victory we wouldnt be treated to the spectacle of dodds ab robbo doing the chicken dance in the chamber at storomont? &#8221; &#8211; edward</p>
<p>If that was the case, why aren&#8217;t they promoting the exclusion of a Shinner from the office of Justice Minister until 2012 as a &#8220;four year decontamination period&#8221;? That&#8217;s what it amounts to, after all.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/11/19/as-of-yet-there-is-no-date-actually-agreed-by-the-politicians/comment-page-1/#comment-276705</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Nov 2008 09:14:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-276705</guid>
		<description>Err, perhaps I should clear mine. I imagine someone got libelled and the Blog was axed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Err, perhaps I should clear mine. I imagine someone got libelled and the Blog was axed.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/11/19/as-of-yet-there-is-no-date-actually-agreed-by-the-politicians/comment-page-1/#comment-276704</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Nov 2008 09:09:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-276704</guid>
		<description>Joe, before you go into conspiracy mode and upset the unstable (USA), perhaps you should clear the cache in your browser and try again? That Blog remains in situ.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Joe, before you go into conspiracy mode and upset the unstable (USA), perhaps you should clear the cache in your browser and try again? That Blog remains in situ.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/11/19/as-of-yet-there-is-no-date-actually-agreed-by-the-politicians/comment-page-1/#comment-276703</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Nov 2008 09:00:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-276703</guid>
		<description>Billy, I&#039;ll think that you&#039;ll find that Gerry Adams qualified his Ard Fheis speech after manners were put on him by Hugh Orde, Ian Paisley, et al, in reaction to it. A similar tone was set by Martin McGuiness when he tried to sell SF entering the Executive to his constituency as &#039;showing civil servants who is the boss.&#039; This was pure spin by both gentlemen, designed to lead the sheep to market. In Gerry&#039;s case, it was spinning endorsement for &#039;Her Majesty&#039;s forces of occupation&#039; as a victory and a continuation of hostility by migrated means rather than a defeat and a rejection of of what was a key &#039;principle&#039; for that ilk. Since the stated aim was the termination of said force and said occupation, he was spinning reform and non-withdrawal (the overwhelming majority of members of the reformed PSNI were members of the RUC) as victory. In Martin&#039;s case, it was spinning a return to Stormont and an agreement to administer British rule as a victory for those whose stated aim was an end to British rule.

In regard to the present fudge, it is now the case that the Shinners must ensure that there is “community support” before the transfer can go ahead. The DUP haven’t defined what exactly constitutes community support beyond saying that they will consult widely within their own party grassroots and community. So, the Shinners had better be on their very best behaviour if they want the unionist community to “support” their pledge to their own constituency to deliver Police &amp; Justice powers. I’d say that means that Gerry should button his lip and not make any more remarks about ‘putting manners’ on the police in addition to meaning that he should put some manners on uppity nationalists who may remain hostile to the police for reasons that Gerry and his ilk formerly promoted.

It’s true that conditions have improved now that the murder gangs have stopped killing people, and that they could have improved 30 years ago if said murder gangs stopped killing people 30 years ago.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Billy, I&#8217;ll think that you&#8217;ll find that Gerry Adams qualified his Ard Fheis speech after manners were put on him by Hugh Orde, Ian Paisley, et al, in reaction to it. A similar tone was set by Martin McGuiness when he tried to sell SF entering the Executive to his constituency as &#8216;showing civil servants who is the boss.&#8217; This was pure spin by both gentlemen, designed to lead the sheep to market. In Gerry&#8217;s case, it was spinning endorsement for &#8216;Her Majesty&#8217;s forces of occupation&#8217; as a victory and a continuation of hostility by migrated means rather than a defeat and a rejection of of what was a key &#8216;principle&#8217; for that ilk. Since the stated aim was the termination of said force and said occupation, he was spinning reform and non-withdrawal (the overwhelming majority of members of the reformed PSNI were members of the RUC) as victory. In Martin&#8217;s case, it was spinning a return to Stormont and an agreement to administer British rule as a victory for those whose stated aim was an end to British rule.</p>
<p>In regard to the present fudge, it is now the case that the Shinners must ensure that there is “community support” before the transfer can go ahead. The DUP haven’t defined what exactly constitutes community support beyond saying that they will consult widely within their own party grassroots and community. So, the Shinners had better be on their very best behaviour if they want the unionist community to “support” their pledge to their own constituency to deliver Police &#038; Justice powers. I’d say that means that Gerry should button his lip and not make any more remarks about ‘putting manners’ on the police in addition to meaning that he should put some manners on uppity nationalists who may remain hostile to the police for reasons that Gerry and his ilk formerly promoted.</p>
<p>It’s true that conditions have improved now that the murder gangs have stopped killing people, and that they could have improved 30 years ago if said murder gangs stopped killing people 30 years ago.</p>
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		<title>By: USA</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/11/19/as-of-yet-there-is-no-date-actually-agreed-by-the-politicians/comment-page-1/#comment-276702</link>
		<dc:creator>USA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Nov 2008 08:31:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-276702</guid>
		<description>Where did the other 81 post blog go on this topic? 
Wouldn&#039;t suprise me if Peter Faker is behind its dissapearance</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Where did the other 81 post blog go on this topic?<br />
Wouldn&#8217;t suprise me if Peter Faker is behind its dissapearance</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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