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	<title>Comments on: Public divided over further devolution [in Wales]</title>
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	<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/09/22/public-divided-over-further-devolution-in-wales/</link>
	<description>Conversation, politics and stray insights</description>
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		<title>By: barnshee</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/09/22/public-divided-over-further-devolution-in-wales/comment-page-1/#comment-262383</link>
		<dc:creator>barnshee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Sep 2008 19:12:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-262383</guid>
		<description>&quot;Income, Corporation, Capital Gains, Inheritance - the whole lot&quot;

FACT 1 the main tax generator in the UK is the SE corner of England most (people most economic activity =most tax)

FACT 2  The &quot;Barnett&quot; formula (named after Joel Barnett) recognises this and reallocates some of the SE England Tax take  across the UK in the form of a subvention (billions of pounds). 
In short the regions get more than they would if the had to depend on the tax raised in the region . 
This,obvious to even the moderately aware, is a very bad deal for the SE of England and a very good deal for the deadbeats in the rest of the UK.
(why the SE  put up with it is beyond me)

You wish to vary your tax rates?
Please proceed Put them up? --don`t think so not a big vote winner there?

Reduce them ? 
1 Will you create new taxation departments ? or ask the existing ones to operate for you (for a fee) 
2 How will you pay for existing services? ask the dreaded ENGLESE for more of their tax?
3 How will you react if the dreaded ENGLESE point out that you are now master of your own destiny for tax and utter the magic words fuck off .</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Income, Corporation, Capital Gains, Inheritance &#8211; the whole lot&#8221;</p>
<p>FACT 1 the main tax generator in the UK is the SE corner of England most (people most economic activity =most tax)</p>
<p>FACT 2  The &#8220;Barnett&#8221; formula (named after Joel Barnett) recognises this and reallocates some of the SE England Tax take  across the UK in the form of a subvention (billions of pounds).<br />
In short the regions get more than they would if the had to depend on the tax raised in the region .<br />
This,obvious to even the moderately aware, is a very bad deal for the SE of England and a very good deal for the deadbeats in the rest of the UK.<br />
(why the SE  put up with it is beyond me)</p>
<p>You wish to vary your tax rates?<br />
Please proceed Put them up? &#8211;don`t think so not a big vote winner there?</p>
<p>Reduce them ?<br />
1 Will you create new taxation departments ? or ask the existing ones to operate for you (for a fee)<br />
2 How will you pay for existing services? ask the dreaded ENGLESE for more of their tax?<br />
3 How will you react if the dreaded ENGLESE point out that you are now master of your own destiny for tax and utter the magic words fuck off .</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Dewi</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/09/22/public-divided-over-further-devolution-in-wales/comment-page-1/#comment-262150</link>
		<dc:creator>Dewi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Sep 2008 20:26:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-262150</guid>
		<description>2 What taxes would you “vary” and how? 

Income, Corporation, Capital Gains, Inheritance - the whole lot.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>2 What taxes would you “vary” and how? </p>
<p>Income, Corporation, Capital Gains, Inheritance &#8211; the whole lot.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: barnshee</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/09/22/public-divided-over-further-devolution-in-wales/comment-page-1/#comment-262089</link>
		<dc:creator>barnshee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Sep 2008 15:38:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-262089</guid>
		<description>Dewi

&quot;Barnshee - it should say tax “varying” powers rather than “raising”. Seems to work OK in other countries around the world. Are we especially incompetent&quot;

1 Er yes
2 What taxes would you &quot;vary&quot; and how?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dewi</p>
<p>&#8220;Barnshee &#8211; it should say tax “varying” powers rather than “raising”. Seems to work OK in other countries around the world. Are we especially incompetent&#8221;</p>
<p>1 Er yes<br />
2 What taxes would you &#8220;vary&#8221; and how?</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Dewi</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/09/22/public-divided-over-further-devolution-in-wales/comment-page-1/#comment-262032</link>
		<dc:creator>Dewi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Sep 2008 02:52:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-262032</guid>
		<description>One of my concerns about the continued success of the devolved bodies is the lack of tax varying powers. Gordon Brown alluded to this the other day when he talked about the illogicality of spending money when not being responsible for raising it. We could have a generation of politicians who do not percieve the economy as their issue.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One of my concerns about the continued success of the devolved bodies is the lack of tax varying powers. Gordon Brown alluded to this the other day when he talked about the illogicality of spending money when not being responsible for raising it. We could have a generation of politicians who do not percieve the economy as their issue.</p>
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		<title>By: percy</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/09/22/public-divided-over-further-devolution-in-wales/comment-page-1/#comment-261989</link>
		<dc:creator>percy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Sep 2008 23:24:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-261989</guid>
		<description>Wonder if my generation will see the death of the British Empire completed?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wonder if my generation will see the death of the British Empire completed?</p>
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		<title>By: Pete Baker</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/09/22/public-divided-over-further-devolution-in-wales/comment-page-1/#comment-261983</link>
		<dc:creator>Pete Baker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Sep 2008 22:41:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-261983</guid>
		<description>Guys

Note the update to the original post.

Neither taxation nor policing and justice are included in the referenced schedule.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Guys</p>
<p>Note the update to the original post.</p>
<p>Neither taxation nor policing and justice are included in the referenced schedule.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Dewi</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/09/22/public-divided-over-further-devolution-in-wales/comment-page-1/#comment-261981</link>
		<dc:creator>Dewi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Sep 2008 22:25:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-261981</guid>
		<description>&quot;The anti “Welshie” Irish factor in Kaydiff and Newport, although in decline just like in Scotland, may well scupper it.&quot;

Dan O Neill in the Echo Sammy? - I wouldn&#039;t overestimate the Irish vote SAmmy although Paul Flynn, Paul Murphy and Don Touhig all MPS from that tradition.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;The anti “Welshie” Irish factor in Kaydiff and Newport, although in decline just like in Scotland, may well scupper it.&#8221;</p>
<p>Dan O Neill in the Echo Sammy? &#8211; I wouldn&#8217;t overestimate the Irish vote SAmmy although Paul Flynn, Paul Murphy and Don Touhig all MPS from that tradition.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: It was Sammy Mc Nally what done it</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/09/22/public-divided-over-further-devolution-in-wales/comment-page-1/#comment-261980</link>
		<dc:creator>It was Sammy Mc Nally what done it</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Sep 2008 22:25:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-261980</guid>
		<description>Pete,

&quot;it being the completion of the devolution process&quot;

I think that statement relates to completion of what was agreed in the STA.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Pete,</p>
<p>&#8220;it being the completion of the devolution process&#8221;</p>
<p>I think that statement relates to completion of what was agreed in the STA.</p>
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	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: It was Sammy Mc Nally what done it</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/09/22/public-divided-over-further-devolution-in-wales/comment-page-1/#comment-261979</link>
		<dc:creator>It was Sammy Mc Nally what done it</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Sep 2008 22:23:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-261979</guid>
		<description>Dewi,

tax raising/varying powers will be chosen battleground for the &#039;No&#039; campaign and it will be a tough fight to get it through. The anti &quot;Welshie&quot; Irish factor in Kaydiff and Newport, although in decline just like in Scotland, may well scupper it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dewi,</p>
<p>tax raising/varying powers will be chosen battleground for the &#8216;No&#8217; campaign and it will be a tough fight to get it through. The anti &#8220;Welshie&#8221; Irish factor in Kaydiff and Newport, although in decline just like in Scotland, may well scupper it.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Dewi</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/09/22/public-divided-over-further-devolution-in-wales/comment-page-1/#comment-261976</link>
		<dc:creator>Dewi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Sep 2008 22:10:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-261976</guid>
		<description>Barnshee - it should say tax &quot;varying&quot; powers rather than &quot;raising&quot;. Seems to work OK in other countries around the world. Are we especially incompetent?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Barnshee &#8211; it should say tax &#8220;varying&#8221; powers rather than &#8220;raising&#8221;. Seems to work OK in other countries around the world. Are we especially incompetent?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: barnshee</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/09/22/public-divided-over-further-devolution-in-wales/comment-page-1/#comment-261975</link>
		<dc:creator>barnshee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Sep 2008 22:05:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-261975</guid>
		<description>Er lets see what tax raisng powers the assembly could have:

1 Local income tax at time when household bills are going thru the roof. No votes there.

2 Excise duties er no next door neighbour would clean up and anyway would only add to bills in 1 above.

3 Shaft the rate payer-- bin taxes, walking down the street tax, support youn local councillor tax. Possible?

Enter the real world</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Er lets see what tax raisng powers the assembly could have:</p>
<p>1 Local income tax at time when household bills are going thru the roof. No votes there.</p>
<p>2 Excise duties er no next door neighbour would clean up and anyway would only add to bills in 1 above.</p>
<p>3 Shaft the rate payer&#8211; bin taxes, walking down the street tax, support youn local councillor tax. Possible?</p>
<p>Enter the real world</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Dewi</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/09/22/public-divided-over-further-devolution-in-wales/comment-page-1/#comment-261974</link>
		<dc:creator>Dewi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Sep 2008 22:02:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-261974</guid>
		<description>Thanks Pete. What is most encouraging is that only 15% would return to pre-assembly days - as 49.7% voted aginst in 1997 that&#039;s very good news.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Pete. What is most encouraging is that only 15% would return to pre-assembly days &#8211; as 49.7% voted aginst in 1997 that&#8217;s very good news.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Pete Baker</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/09/22/public-divided-over-further-devolution-in-wales/comment-page-1/#comment-261972</link>
		<dc:creator>Pete Baker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Sep 2008 21:57:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-261972</guid>
		<description>Fixed now, Dewi.

It was just a link to the BBC report quoted at the end.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fixed now, Dewi.</p>
<p>It was just a link to the BBC report quoted at the end.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Dewi</title>
		<link>http://sluggerotoole.com/2008/09/22/public-divided-over-further-devolution-in-wales/comment-page-1/#comment-261970</link>
		<dc:creator>Dewi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Sep 2008 21:52:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-261970</guid>
		<description>THe &quot;further powers&quot; link dosn&#039;t seem to work for me Pete.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>THe &#8220;further powers&#8221; link dosn&#8217;t seem to work for me Pete.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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