“Martin the police did not plant the bomb your former associates did..”
In the Sunday Independent, Alan Murray quotes Victor Barker, whose son was killed in the Omagh bombing in 1998, on a text conversation he had with Northern Ireland deputy First Minister, Sinn Féin’s Martin McGuinness, on the day of the council’s official ceremony. From the report
Victor Barker said he first met Martin McGuinness in a hotel in Buncrana shortly after his 12 year-old son was murdered in 1998. “He wanted to come round to the house to pay his respects but I didn’t want that and we met in the hotel. Since then we have communicated intermittently over the years and I did meet him with Gerry Adams and Gerry Kelly but that meeting was not a terribly good one.“Nothing came of it and I was very disappointed by the response from Adams in particular. On Friday I decided to send a text to Martin McGuinness to again ask him to give that vital assistance and urge his fellow republicans to give the information that would convict the bombers but again he wouldn’t agree to that. But when Sinn Fein does take that step it will show that they are genuinely into peace and a system of justice which should protect everybody, Catholic and Protestant,” he said.
And, on the day of the un-official ceremony, he also quotes the chairman of the Omagh Self Help and Support Group, Michael Gallagher
Mr Gallagher said: “Sinn Fein has done nothing to help bring the bombers to justice and to see their mayor opening the memorial garden was too much for me to take.”
That is a brilliant line – and just the line to remind people not to try and equate any police mishandling of the aftermath with the act of carrying out the bombing.
MMcG won’t encourage anyone to come forward about the RIRA bombing as it opens the door to demands that he would have to do the same about the two people killed by the PIRA in the same year e.g Andrew Kearney (murdered a month before).
Sooner or later SF will have to answer these questions because they will be asked time and time again.
Even if it takes 20years many people will not forget and will delay any movement towards a UI.
So much for SF contribution to the national debate.
They will be ignored despite their mandate and they wonder why this is the case.
I will not give to them any respect until they put their house in order and that includes unfinished business re the disappeared.
Every long journey starts with a first step and they have a long way to go!
I wouldn’t be one bit surprised if the IRA Army Council co-operated or had knowledge of cooperation between the dissidents and IRA/Sinn Fein, during the time of the Omagh bomb and after.
God help those poor families, over the years what they’ve went through would get tears from a stone. They ought to hand over the bastards that did this and give these families closure.
Napoleons Nose
They cant hand them over. What would they then do about those who killed all the others …. including some who are now senior party figures? That’s one of the fudges at the heart of the agreements – and one the UUP and DUP implicitly signed up to.
Given the fact that the Real IRA was riddled with informers, the infamous David Rupert among them, who are stepping forward now to give testimony against the dissidents, and given that there is some dispute over the information which the RUC had about the bombing beforehand, there is a valid argument that the police have as much association with the bombers as the IRA or SF had.
There is every reason to suspect that the police have as much of a grip on the information regarding the bombers in this terrible atrocity as the SF had. The security forces have form – remember McGurk’s bar and the Dublin and Monaghan bombing.
Disgusting fake sympathy from Concubhar.
To think this man has the gall to claim he is not a party stooge.
“God help those poor families, over the years what they’ve went through would get tears from a stone. They ought to hand over the bastards that did this and give these families closure.”
Indeed? But are you referring to the Shankill Bomb? Omagh? Bloody Sunday? Julie Livingstone? The Miami Showband? Gibraltar? Louhinisland? Sefton the Horse?
Tricky, isn’t it? The problem of multi-sided conflict is that there are claims to victimhood on all sides. All equally strongly felt. Throw in the added complication of cause and effect and you can see that isolating one incident out of context while satisfying emotionally – “It was their fault” – is extremely self-indulgent and practically pointless.
You might save some disappointment by being slightly more sophisticated in your approach or you can stamp your feet and demand that people see the world your way. Whatever floats your boat, really…
…and here comes the whataboutery.
billie joe
In your litany of atrocities why did you omit Bloody Friday in Belfast ,Claudy La Mon and Enniskillen.
You have been very selective in what you wish to highlight.
There’s no doubt that a quite a few unionist figures are at a loss now that they can’t wring their hands and blame ‘evil’ republicans for perpetrating the destruction of our wee pravince. This is borne out by the futile attempts to link mainstream republicanism to this atrocity.
How pitiful this looks from the same hypocrites who averted their eyes when numerous atrocities were carried out by loyalists.
I well remember the half-hearted condemnation by unionist politicians of loyalist violence which were inevitably followed by a pause then a squalid justification along the lines of ‘but you know that this was a reaction to ….ad nauseum’
These people were happy to hide behind the apron strings of their British paymasters who clearly knew a helluva lot more about the internal machinations of the Real IRA than the clueless RUC.
How it must stick in their collective craw that Sinn Fein is now in such a position of power…
longshot
You are wrong.Please be more specific and give examples where unionists were half hearted in their condemnation of atrocities committed by loyalists.
We simply want to know the truth about Omagh Claudy Bloody Friday and many other tragedies.
We believe SF/IRA have some information and could assist.
billy jo unremarkable you really do spout the greatest amount of shite I’ve ever read
‘billy jo unremarkable you really do spout the greatest amount of shite I’ve ever read’
Oh Dear, I think that you scored a bullseye there,Billie Joe.
The truth indeed hurts as Napoleon’s kneb has so amply demonstrated…
“given that there is some dispute over the information which the RUC had about the bombing beforehand, there is a valid argument that the police have as much association with the bombers as the IRA or SF had. ”
Sorry but Nuala O’Loan put that one to bed. There’s no dispute. You can’t fall back on that excuse so why not just go back to the 13th century and allege ‘but sure the Brits made us do it ‘?
And anyway, when SF now ‘condemn’ it, why did they positively obstruct nationalists cooperating with the police investigation, just as they did in the murder in the Markets?
I’m not saying that former associates of SF or the IRA had nothing to do with it – I just don’t take it as read that the same can’t be said for the police with their informers. So go take a hike back to the 13th century yourself.
SF can answer for itself – I apologise for interrupting your let’s pin everything possible on SF party.
Disgusting fake sympathy from Concubhar.
To think this man has the gall to claim he is not a party stooge.
I resent that remark SRR – but given that it’s you, I expect little else except this ad hominem stuff. As I have said numerous times, I’m no one’s stooge. Not SF’s, not any one’s. There’s nothing fake about my sympathy for the victims of the Omagh bombing – but I have my suspicions about your sympathy for the victims.
‘Indeed? But are you referring to the Shankill Bomb? Omagh? Bloody Sunday? Julie Livingstone? The Miami Showband? Gibraltar?’
No I was referring to Omagh, which was the subject of the thread, but I also condemn murder or terrorism from any quarter.
‘Tricky, isn’t it?’
Not a bit.
‘You might save some disappointment by being slightly more sophisticated in your approach or you can stamp your feet and demand that people see the world your way.’
I’ve never argued for anyone to see the world my way, please provide evidence of where I did.
‘Oh Dear, I think that you scored a bullseye there,Billie Joe.’
The bullseye being……???
As I said shite, but austin do feel free to spread it.
once again, unionists on this site condemn all terrorist atrocities as they should, while nationalists/republicans seek to condemn and blame everyone else
“I apologise for interrupting your let’s pin everything possible on SF party”
Dont worry…with so many dead there’s more than enough blame to go around even with apologists like you trying desperately to excuse the inexcusable. And you will see that in other issues I am happy to pin any blame where I think it lies – whoever that may be. And in this case that means the bombers and their former comrades who would not give them up or let anyone else do so.
” There’s nothing fake about my sympathy for the victims of the Omagh bombing – but I have my suspicions about your sympathy for the victims. ”
…ah so now we have a hierarchy of sympathy as well. My sympathy is more sympathetic / real than yours.
Have you any self-awareness? Any idea how disgraceful that sounds?
we can not rule out Omagh having something in common with Coshquin.
Should that be the case, all relevant bodies will have something hiding in the closet.
‘I wouldn’t be one bit surprised if the IRA Army Council co-operated or had knowledge of cooperation between the dissidents and IRA/Sinn Fein, during the time of the Omagh bomb and after.’
rather like the british army and Govt having knowledge and aided in many atrocities over the years.
‘In your litany of atrocities why did you omit Bloody Friday in Belfast ,Claudy La Mon and Enniskillen.
You have been very selective in what you wish to highlight.’
Ahh But BJR mentioned at least two atrocities that can be laid at the floor of certain republicans (Shankill Bomb? Omagh?), but do you see what you’ve done here, you have been very selective yourself in choosing to suggest others he left out. Funny that ain’t it? Why didn’t you include a few atrocities carried out by loyalists, after all your condemning BJR for being selective, it seems you have been even more selective than him….D’oh, should i not have pointed that out?
‘once again, unionists on this site condemn all terrorist atrocities as they should, while nationalists/republicans seek to condemn and blame everyone else’
Once again you talk shite and to sum up i refer you to the paragraphs above.
Rs
My comment was directed to billie -joe who I presume can speak for him/herself and was simply curious to know why that particular list was drawn up and solely in the interests of balance added a few more atrocities to be considered.
‘…and solely in the interests of balance added a few more atrocities to be considered.’
and of course they were ones inflicted on the unionist community and by doing so you made an absolute hypocrite out of yourself. its there for all to see now, squirm out of it all you want.
ulsterfan: No offence but I mentioned the Shankill bomb and Sefton the Horse. I appreciate that, clearly, you’re not too bright so why don’t you google both of those terms?
And by the way, when ‘Brave’ Sefton was injured (London 1982) it was mentioned in tabloid headlines – by name. The five or so British soldiers who died along with the horses were not given the hero treatment that the horse was. An issue of muchg comment at the time. I chose a range of “atrocities” to suit all prejudices. Yet again I say, we all have our grievances.
Try not to be so dim.
billie
Thank you for your reply.
I was aware of all the bombings to which you refer.
There were some very notable omissions and I wished to highlight these.
Napoleon’s Nose & Ulster fan. Have a look…
http://www.theonion.com/content/news/local_idiot_to_post_comment_on
“There were some very notable omissions and I wished to highlight these.”
Notable omissions? Well, yeah, I didn’t mention McGurk’s bar either. How many atrocities do you need listed? Should only some be mentioned or should we list everything that ever happened? Might that not take a very long time.
See my previous post. Check out the link. Think.
billie
Had a quick look at the link.
Surely you have better things to do than read something so uninteresting.
ulsterfan perhaps it was unremarkables attempt at humour?
zzzzzzzzzzzzz
How many atrocities do you need listed?
Why did you feel you needed to list other attrocities in a thread about Omagh?
See my previous post. Check out the link. Think.
Is that what you are doing – thinking? By engaging in whataboutery. lol
‘Is that what you are doing – thinking? By engaging in whataboutery. lol’
Quit slagging ulsterfan, i thought he was your mate !
Never mind the fact that fools who churn out the old whataboutery slag usually do so because of uncomfortable hometruths. Back to St Helena with you.
Put the handbags down, guys.
And try to get back to the actual topic.
Quit slagging ulsterfan, i thought he was your mate !
Napoleon’s Nose & Ulster fan. Have a look…
Ahhhhhhhhhhhh is that what is going on. You guys haven’t worked out yet what side of the fence I’m from, or what boot I kick with…..
Amazing!
Even though ulsterfan was civil to unremarkable decided to be rude anyway. First unremarkable calls ulsterfan dim, and on and on….
jesus christ some people cannot rise above their tribal prejudices can they?
no worries pete. good night.
Mine is bigger than yours ….etc…etc…etc
Has school restarted already?
Schools still out but the Slugger summer camp is definitley in !
Can I suggest that we appoint a List Commission with representatives drawn from all sides to compose a definitive agreed list of atrocities committed by all sides. That could then simply be cross referred to in any post on whataboutery saving tedious repetition. I know it would save me, and many others here, much typing time.
We will of course need an impartial Chair, a Secretariat and Commissioners as well as an Ombudsman that those atrocities missed out or excluded can appeal. There will also need to be a consultation period while the Committee decides on its criteria and processes, commissions research from at least 15 academics (to cover all permutations of race, religion, community background, gender, sexual orientation and disability) and consults widely across the Slugger Community. About 3 years should do for all this before the Commission starts work.
Once ‘The List’ (TM) is in place the possibilities are endless. We may even get a PEACE VI EU Grant for Mick to develop the blog so that as soon as one of us mentions a specific atrocity, in the interest of fairness, the system automatically inserts references to a series of balancing atrocities.
billie-Joe Remarkable,
Can I just intervene to say that the Vis-organizer is just a brilliantly stupid idea. Thank you for linking that.
cynic
The best idea I have heard this year.
I am not doing anything at the moment and would of course be willing to help if the money was right—–( should I have said that?)
Think of all that respectability!
Can someone explain what this means to me??
‘engaging in whataboutery’
Can someone explain what this means to me??
‘engaging in whataboutery’…
http://www.everything2.com/e2node/Whataboutery
When you have a little piece of earth inhabited by two tribes whataboutery becomes the common language in discussions within a few posts…
Hope this helps! : )
David
Martin Ingram and Kevin Fulton were on the Alex Jones show a few years ago and they made a couple of comments about the Omagh bomb and who was responsible. I’m not a fan of Alex Jones but the interview is probably online somewhere and worth a listen.
“About 3 years” – if so would be 7 years less than the Saville inquiry. How can such an inquiry take 4 years longer than world war 2? Absolute scandal.