“a special meeting of chairmen and secretaries of all clubs in the county.. as soon as possible”
The Chairman of the Fermanagh County Board of the GAA, Peter Carty, has issued a statement on behalf of the Board in relation to the sectarian abuse reported by Darren Graham recently. One paragraph, in particular, caught my eye
Darren Graham has been and continues to be a skilful exponent of football and hurling; he has made incredible efforts to be part of our games and has taken deep pride in representing Lisnaskea Emmetts. We are deeply upset that Darren has had to outline details of sectarian abuse to the Co. Board. We are also concerned at inaccurate and unfair media coverage of this issue. No player, no sportsman, no person should have to put up with such treatment and as a Co. Board we unreservedly apologise to Darren for any type of abuse he may have suffered on whatever occasion. Clubs or individuals who mete out any kind of abuse, including sectarian abuse, to others will be severely punished and such people are not welcome within our organisation.
The Chairman’s statement in full
We in the GAA, and in Fermanagh Co. Board in particular, have always taken pride in being a non-sectarian and non-political organisation. We unreservedly condemn abuse of any sort whether it occurs on or off the pitch and will not tolerate sectarian abuse of any of our members. In Fermanagh we have been especially proud of the fact that over the years many of the Protestant faith have given of their best to our games and have worn their club jersey with intense pride and continue to do so.
Darren Graham has been and continues to be a skilful exponent of football and hurling; he has made incredible efforts to be part of our games and has taken deep pride in representing Lisnaskea Emmetts. We are deeply upset that Darren has had to outline details of sectarian abuse to the Co. Board. We are also concerned at inaccurate and unfair media coverage of this issue. No player, no sportsman, no person should have to put up with such treatment and as a Co. Board we unreservedly apologise to Darren for any type of abuse he may have suffered on whatever occasion. Clubs or individuals who mete out any kind of abuse, including sectarian abuse, to others will be severely punished and such people are not welcome within our organisation.
We would want to apologise to any player who gives of his time, his energy and his commitment and is then subject to totally inappropriate remarks or treatment. We, in Fermanagh, make a promise to all our hard-working players, and members in general, that sectarian abuse or abuse of any sort towards them will never be tolerated and such behaviour will be rooted out. Referees, players and clubs are now on full alert with regard to such behaviour and severe penalties will ensue. Young people like Darren Graham deserve the highest praise for the effort they make, the hard work they put in and the endurance they show. We in the Co. board are behind them all the way; they have our unconditional support.
We have spoken with Darren who says that he would like to get on with his playing career encouraged as he is by the promises given. We are at the moment working very closely with him as regards his case and he is reassured that he and all players will be supported, protected and looked after to the very best of our ability.
We in Fermanagh Co. board and in the GAA are totally non-sectarian; we are open to all and we will not allow sectarian abuse to gain the slightest toe-hold within our organisation. With this in mind a special meeting of chairmen and secretaries of all clubs in the county will be convened as soon as possible to be addressed by leading GAA officials, including former Uachtarán of the Association Jack Boothman.
Peter Carty
Chairman
Fermanagh Co. Board
I can’t image that any potential new member of CLG when signing up filled out ‘member of the IRA’ in the line for occupation. Therefore I can’t image that the GAA would have known which member was part of that secret organization. The RUC on the other hand, falsely portrayed themselves as guardians of the peace and upstanding members of the community and their occupation would have been filled out in their applications.
What a pathetic and disingenuous reply.
oh willow, did I not give you the reply you wanted – tough !!
“the RUC, in general, was a bigoted organization so much so that it didn’t receive support from almost half the population.”
Same could be said of the GAA itself – and it would be just as big a load of tosh.
Cruimh,
CLG is a sporting organization so whether or not they receive support from any percentage of the population doesn’t reflect on the organization. Likewise the NI Tiddlywinks Club doesn’t need to get the support of everyone in NI.
The Police in any civilized community should get the people’s support. Or as NI has shown us because of the behaviour of the RUC, UDR / BSpecials in NI almost half of the popululation will wish for it to be disbanded becasue they are not impartial or just plain sectarian murderers.
“CLG is a sporting organization”
untrue – it is a political organisation.
You cannot use the relatively low percentage of RCs to imply or prove that any organisation is “bigoted”.
And you ignore the fact that showing support for the police in any way was extremely dangerous for the minority populus here.
“untrue – it is a political organisation. ”
untrue and this thread and many others over the last few weeks have sought to portray CLG as primarily non sporting… and failed.
“You cannot use the relatively low percentage of RCs to imply or prove that any organisation is “bigotedâ€. ”
I didn’t. I’m saying that the UDR is bigoted as 17% of their members were engaged in illegal paramilitary activity. Same goes for the RUC as their SB were so closely linked to the UVF et al (see Mount Vernon in the news today). But what do you expect… they were set up to enforce a sectarian one party rule statlet.
By your rationale the British Army was engaged in ethnic cleansing as they killed Catholics… all the IRA members killed were RC so the British Army should be in front of the court at The Hague ??
“And you ignore the fact that showing support for the police in any way was extremely dangerous for the minority populus here. ”
showing support… those killed were members of the security forces. During the period NI was a dangerous place. Each side had those that signed up and those that didn’t.
untrue – it is a political organisation.
“untrue!
The constitution and rules of the GAA prove otherwise.
“I’m saying that the UDR is bigoted”
Whoa – that’s a spectacular movement of the goalposts – we were talking about the Police – from your post !!!!
“the RUC, in general, was a bigoted organization so much so that it didn’t receive support from almost half the population.â€
“
“showing support… those killed were members of the security forces.”
Bernard Taggert – a 15 year old boy with severe learning difficulties was abducted by Adams IRA from school,’interrogated’, shot in the head and left to die in the grounds of Belfast zoo.
He wasn’t a member of the security forces.
not heading out on the ‘swall, tonight, Cruimh?
not heading out on the ‘swall, tonight, Cruimh?
eh ? I’m “heretipioneer”!
Heretipioneer?
The proddy version of the pioneers – satan’s buttermilk is not for me !
But is there some reason for celebration?
FERMANAGH
we were discussing the alledged ethnic cleasning in FERMANAGH
no changing the goal posts we were discussing the security forces therefore including the UDR, RUC, BSpecials, BA, UDA, Mt Vernon UVF / SB etc.
“no changing the goal posts we were discussing the security forces”
The comment of yours that I addressed :
“the RUC, in general, was a bigoted organization so much so that it didn’t receive support from almost half the population.â€
as opposed to trying to deflect from points made to deal with the semantics of naming, security forces or UDR or RUC or UVF, I’ll include some factual information about the UDR and their involvement in terrorist activity. You’ll note that the UDR were interconnected with the RUC and UVF thro’out…
http://sluggerotoole.com/index.php/weblog/comments/details_on_that_udr_and_collusion_story/
I’m saying that the UDR is bigoted as 17% of their members were engaged in illegal paramilitary activity.
Any evidence for this claim?!!
páirc na saileach,
there’s the 15% which features in the attached link.
I then extrapolated to account for the lying, self-serving mechanisim of minimising the culpability in state sponsered terrorism which would have been prevalent in a British report about the criminal activity in one of their own regiments, hence 17%. However, in re reading the article, I now think I should have added in a far larger ‘margin of erroreerrrr eh, lies’ from British Gov documents.
15%, man, that turns out to be almost one in seven members of the UDR were state sponsered terrorists according to the govs own figures…. anyone got figures for the Taliban and the number of Al Queda. It looks like the disgrace of the UDR should have brought about a USA invasion of NI to counter STATE SPONSERED TERRORISM.
anonymous
Are you trying to justify the sectarian abuse of Darren Graham within the GAA by smearing his father and uncle who were UDR members and who were murdered by the IRA ?
anonymous
doesn’t it bother you that the mere fact that you feel the need to Gaelicise willowfield’s name is the clearest possible proof of your own bigotry, and inability to extend to others the tolerance and right to self expression which ought to be their right?
I have objected to people calling our invisible Sinner MEP “Barbara Brown” in the past, and you’re just as bad. It weakens your otherwise articlutae arguments
Incidentally , the word is “sponsored”. And this is not the only intellectual shortcoming in your argument.
For example. The UDR may indeed possibly have had a significant minority of members with connections to illegal organisations at one time. Perhaps a significant minority of GAA members were in the IRA as well-certainly many IRA members were. Does that make the GAA a terrorist- or a bigotted-organisation? If some members did not live up to the highest standards of the organisation is the whole organisation to blame? There were/are many decent and honourable sportsmen in the GAA. It’s just wrong to attribute personality traits to organisations.
Now what you present as logic- that if 17% are deemed “connected” the whole must be tainted is a tenable, though tendentious, point when judged against the statistics since we cannot actually know who conspired to kill whom in every case.I’m long enough in the tooth to know that government statistics are the most inaccurate statistics on the planet too.And frankly, the staggeringly poor killrate of IRA members and especially leaders by these supposedly state controlled ruthless terror gangs suggests that they were rather less widespread than your paranoia ought to predict.
The standard MOPE conspiracy theory as I understand it is that random sectarian murder of innocent Roman Catholics was designed to show the RC community that the IRA could not protect them, therefore don’t support them. But surely a state-inspired terror group with quasi-immunity would just waltz in, take out the IRA leadership, and hey presto the enemy is ineffective- keep doing it to any new leadership till the message penetrates the brains of the activists. Wasn’t that the logic behind internment, which the securocrats believed failed because of poor intelligence and advance warning?
Furthermore,your emotional starting point assumes, but fails to establish, when the whole is corrupted by part-again because your emotions distort your judgment.
If 1% of the UDR was “connected” at one time, while obviously unaccaptable, would it be fair to condemn the whole cadre perhaps ten years later? If the terrorist actions of a rogue unit in S Armagh accounted for innocent dead in 1975, does that justify condemning or killing an elderly part time soldier in North Antrim in 1973, or 1983? No- it’s only the excuse.
If one GAA club-say in S Armagh again- has a larger than average number of members with IRA pasts I would be entirely wrong to say the Wicklow county board was riddled with Provos.But if any paramilitary presence taints the whole, then it’s surely at the leadership level.
And here consistency must lead you to shun our present government, especially our Deputy First Minister and his party- ain’t that so?
JEB “Are you trying to justify the sectarian abuse of Darren Graham within the GAA by smearing his father and uncle who were UDR members and who were murdered by the IRA ? “
No,
As I posted prominently in a previous post “hence I posted “Please don’t think that this is an attempt to justify the killings. It’s my attempt to analyse others postings claiming ethnic cleansing which I don’t think holds up.†but of course you wish to read what you wish to read.
Also, I didn’t gorify the killings by Fintan did – I’m just responding to his tabloidesque reporting.
The páirc na saileach is for my own humour…. However I note in your very next line that you include “our invisible Sinner MEP… “ in reference to a member of Sinn Fein (check the spelling). It’s a common word play by all in NI from calling Babs by her Anglicised name, Frank Ross similarly, on to Ian Og…. get used to it.
“It weakens your otherwise articlutae arguments†don’t patronize me; you as a memorial pisser are not in a position to take the high ground on much on this site. All those years in college and King’s Inns and you resort to patronizing and commenting on my mis spelling (BTW it’s articulate, try spell check before you post about spelling) !??!
The GAA is first and foremost a sporting organization. As is the Tiddlywinks Club of NI. The UDR was ‘officially’ establish and funded as a member of the security forces which accross the world should mean a fair and balanced pillar of govern. The UDR failed miserably at this most basic of requirements from inception as they were just the B Specials in new uniforms – the B Specials who were a bigoted disgrace – we all agree on that, right? The UDR as supposed members of civic security should be held to a higher level of scrutiny while the GAA / Tiddlywinks Club of NI can’t be considered anyway comparable.
“…would it be fair to condemn the whole cadre perhaps ten years laterâ€
Yes of course. By your rationale then the IRA’s large- civilian- killings of Bloody Friday to Enniskillen were in the past but all IRA ‘cadre’ shouldn’t be condemned ?!?! A strange position from you. By this rationale therefore it would therefore be correct for said IRA or their electoral representatives to be in govt.
“But surely a state-inspired terror group with quasi-immunity would just waltz in…â€
no because the security forces in NI were even useless at being bigoted murderers like for instance putting a bomb in a Miami Showband bus so badly that two blew themselves up. The Dub / Monaghan bombs were only “successful†as they’d the support of the BA’s equivalent of FRU of the time. Until then the UDR / UVF were limited to bombs with a lit fuse.
The standard U-MOPE conspiracy (Unionist MOPE) seems to be that the UDR were decent people dastardly killed when in fact a large number of UDR were involved w state sponsored terrorism.
Anonymous
there’s the 15% which features in the attached link.
The link only refers to 5 – 15% in a single year – 1973. Recruitment was tightened up as a result of this report. So extrapolated over the full lifetime of the UDR, the figure will be nowhere near what you claim.
15%, man, that turns out to be almost one in seven members of the UDR were state sponsered terrorists according to the govs own figures….
It doesn’t for the reasons above, but also because the members in question were not “state-sponsored”: they were paramitaries who infiltrated the UDR, not the other way round.
Try to be honest and objective.
“Recruitment was tightened up as a result of this report.…so extrapolated over the full lifetime of the UDR, the figure will be nowhere near what you claim.“
that would be funny if it wasn’t so sad.
15% from an INTERNAL report which will try and minimize the failure that was this state sponsored terrorist regiment. About a regiment who basis was sectarian as it came directly from the bigoted BSpecials and was also completely Protestant. What internal controls? – there were none and the UDR continued to provide employment for criminals, wasters and thugs. Now 34 years after that report, the character and recurring feature of it’s successor RIR, is of ingrained bigotry (orange parade in Baghdad and racist bebo sites).
They should have shut down the UDR back then and admitted that it was tainted with bigotry and sectarianism. Then we wouldn’t have had the Glennane Gang who brought about the worse year (1974) and the Kingsmills killings all the way thro to the UDR 4 case and RIR man Jonathan Russell convicted of riot at Drumcree and RIR mocking the death of Rosemary Nelson.
The RIR are a bigoted disgrace as were their murdering father’s in the UDR and their thug grandfathers in the B-Specials.
“…they were paramitaries who infiltrated the UDR, not the other way roundâ€
state sponsored is the exact term for it as the British Govt knew that they’d hired the B Specials thugs and continued employing them. They knew there were sectarian killers in the UDR as the Irish Govt told them after the Dub Monaghan bombs. It a old British colonial custom to use indigenous elements (local thug paramilitaries like the UDR, whites in Rhodesia) to combat the nationalists. Get used to it…. you were used and abused by your masters for decades – prima noce howrya ?!?!
Anonymous
“It a old British colonial custom to use indigenous elements (local thug paramilitaries like the UDR, whites in Rhodesia)”
The whites in Rhodesia had a large degree of self government and their own army and airforce long before there was a significant campaign against white rule, hence the initial sucess of UDI. Nationalism pre UDI and for the first 5 years or so of UDI involved very little violence. The real military problems for the white Rhodesians only started about 1976.
Also remember that Rhodesia declared UDI precisely because they did not want to accept the idea of admitting some black power (albeit very limited) in order to get Dominion status (like Australia, Canada etc.) as the British government demanded.
As a separate point I have previously noted and welcomed your objection to all killings but the following
“Then we wouldn’t have had the Glennane Gang who brought about the worse year (1974) and the Kingsmills killings ” begins to look like a justification for Kingsmill.
I do not doubt that you are not using it as that but one needs to be careful in using a given atrocity to explain another. They may have been the excuses given by the murderers but they are only excuses by people who were only too happy to get on with murdering without any reason.
“The RIR are a bigoted disgrace as were their murdering father’s in the UDR and their thug grandfathers in the B-Specials. ”
I am sure there were bigots in all three of these organisations. I also knew and know multiple members of all three orgainsations who were not bigots. Denouncing all of them as bigots is grossly unfair and can help those who think the murder of these people was justifable.
there is no justification for Kingsmills (even Gerry came out against this years ago).
The McCaughey (RUC), Jackson, R McConnell (UDR) killings (with the help of Chief SuperDooper RUC man Breen) of the O’Dowds (2 brothers & an uncle , all SDLP) and the Reaveys (3 brothers) on the same night, led to the Kingsmills killings a couple of days later. There is no justification. A reactionary killing (an old UDA rubbish excuse) is just a pathetic attempt to absolve oneself.
However nothing should be looked at in isolation. The Glenanne Gang were the worst killers in the ’70′s… they were also, nearly to a man, members of the UDR, RUC and were in contact w the BA. They possibly killed as many as the Shankill Butchers.
Conclusion: too many members of the UDR were involved in terrorism to be considered a ‘few bad apples’ therefore the battallion as a whole is comdemned. The British Gov knew thro’out and didn’t intervene therefore compliant and equally as guilty – state sponsored murders. RIR’s no different today or since inception; do I have to remind you of Poyntzpass?
anonymous
The reason I asked you earlier if you were justifying the sectarian abuse of Darren because of his family’s connection to the UDR was because I could not see why on a thread about the GAA’s belated response to sectarianism within its own ranks you were filling up Mick’s expensive facility with 35 year old reports about the UDR ?
What exactly is the connection to abuse in the GAA in the early 21st century if it is not Darren Graham ?
Or is it just you are in complete denial and looking for a distraction ?
no JEB,
I was originally commenting about DGraham & GAA, some one else brought up ethnic cleansing (over 35 years). I posted data showing the majority killed were security forces and not killed sole for their religion ie. ethnic cleansing. I use ‘official’ reports to back up my claims (where’s the counter-claims data and figures? oh we’ve now move to “perceptions”… as if this should be acceptable in discussing NI society !!).
what’s your problem? don’t like where someone else brought this debate and want to get back talking about the GAA? lets just complain about the GAA?
I didn’t bring the thread to ethnic cleansing nor to the UDR but now you want me to stop talking about this? Get a grip. I don’t think poor ol’ Mick’s site should be used just to slag off the GAA and speak about ethnic cleansing.
How’s yer maths coming along? 2 + 2 still equals 22 ?
keep her lit,lads, keep her lit.
anonymous
“what’s your problem? don’t like where someone else brought this debate and want to get back talking about the GAA? lets just complain about the GAA?”
You are a very excitable chap i can just see you pouring over your ‘official reports’ jumping up and down as you find something to reinforce your already wharped prejudices !
I just thought that the thread should stay on topic.
Let me ask you this straight question – do you think PIRA was justified in killing Darren Graham’s Father and Uncle ?
“You are a very excitable chap…”
and you’re big into perceptions – a probable source of some of NI’s problems. I’m actually a very mellow fellow and no one would ever call me a ‘chap’. I’m also seriously handsome if you want to pass that on to some females!!! (not)
“I just thought that the thread should stay on topic. ”
now that’s a big fat lie and your pants are on fire. You didn’t like the posts (or where an orange poster had brought the thread) and wanted to move it back to “fcuking GAA, us poor Protestants etc”
“…do you think PIRA was justified in killing Darren Graham’s Father and Uncle ?
no, nay, never !!!
how come I’ve written this continually on this thread and the other Graham-GAA-UDR thread and I still have to answer it?
I know some are eagerly awaiting me come out with ‘justifiable targets’, ‘collateral damage’ (a la MOD reports from Iraq about civilian deaths) and ‘they knew what they were getting into when they signed up’ but I won’t because that’s not what I think? Turgon accepted this, why don’t you?
It’s quid pro quo time: “Let me ask you this straight question – do you think …” the UDR / Glennane Gang killiings or the UDR killing of Seamus Heany’s cousin or UDR killing of Patsy Kelly from Trillick (for which a Omagh DUP counciller was recently ‘interviewed) were justified?
Contempory UDR: do you think the RIR killings in Poyntzpass was justified or the RIR slagging off the mourners of Rosemary Nelson was a good giggle?
anonymous
My record of opposition to illegal activity – whether paramilitary or government has never waivered.
Regarding the UDR I have both friends and relatives who served in it and not one of them was involved in paramilitarism or criminality of any kind.
Indeed if it wasnt for the forces of law and order – RUC, Army, UDR/RIR and the Court Service – then NI would have been a much more unpleasnat place to live.
The vast majority of all of these people were honourable and courageous people.
Now you can go scraping the bottom of the barrel all you like to justify what you already believe but this kind of discussion regularly occurs on Slugger and I am up for it when the context arises on related thread.
Meanwhile the real topic of the thread was about the reaction of the GAA to Darren Graham.
If you dont want to discuss those hard home truths then that is your problem but dont hide behind a lot of bluster about security force collusion – it is quite pathetic actually.
liar, liar, pants on fire.
“Indeed if it wasnt for the forces of law and order – RUC, Army, UDR/RIR and the Court Service – then NI would have been a much more unpleasnat place to live. ”
they were the source of a lot of the problems in NI. Not, however, from your orange tinted viewpoint – they were probably all every nice chaps altogether from when you met them.
A very large % of the population (maybe 50%) hated (many with venom and most with good reason) firstly the BSpecial/UDR, secondly the RUC/BA and lastly the courts. They weren’t courageous as, when fully armed, they bullied and attacked young nationalists (especially GAA fans) with impunity – not very honourable of them.
“…scraping the bottom of the barrel all you like to justify…â€
now JEB, you asked me a direct question and I gave you a direct answer. I asked you questions and you don’t answer them but post a generalized, unconvincing lightweight pulp and then move to accusing me of scrapping the barrel. Something not quite fair there!! Answer the questions ask and don’t claim that all those killings by the UDR was barrel scraping.
As for my relatives; not a one ever knew what a gun was like (they would have been closer to caulking guns) and the rest’s uniform would have been a nurses’. We’ve never had the need to pick up a gun for honour (whether misplaced or not). Now that, darth, is a high horse !!!
anonymous
I am sorry but this is way too infantile and boring for me – bye
what hurt you?
was it the following…
now JEB, you asked me a direct question and I gave you a direct answer. I asked you questions and you don’t answer them but post a generalized, unconvincing lightweight pulp and then move to accusing me of scrapping the barrel. Something not quite fair there!! Answer the questions ask and don’t claim that all those killings by the UDR was barrel scraping.
anonymous
15% from an INTERNAL report which will try and minimize the failure that was this state sponsored terrorist regiment.
The whole purpose of the report was to get a grip on a situation in which loyalists had infiltrated the UDR. Recruitment was tightened up as a result of the report. Extrapolated over the full lifetime of the UDR, the figure will be nowhere near what you claim. You’re being dishonest, which indicates that your views are based on naked prejudice rather than an objective assessment of the facts.
About a regiment who basis was sectarian as it came directly from the bigoted BSpecials and was also completely Protestant.
Actually, it replaced the B-Specials specifically to rectify that perception and its purpose was to be a cross-community force. It achieved 18% RC recruitment at the start, but this declined rapidly due to IRA intimidation. It is simply a lie to say that was “completely Protestant”. Again, you’re not dealing in facts: merely your own prejudices.
What internal controls? – there were none and the UDR continued to provide employment for criminals, wasters and thugs.
You’ve no evidence for this at all: a completely worthless statement.
Anonymous,
Can I suggest the problem with your posts and the respoinse you get is that you do genuninely oppose violence. I accept that entirely.
However, your language when describing especially the UDR is extremely one sided and involves blanket condemnation of a very large number of people (only some of whom deserve it) without any acceptance that many of us have relatives who were in the UDR and were not evil bigoted thugs. My wife’s relatives who were in the UDR are (and were) honest people who felt it was their duty to join. They were also quite wealthy so employment was clearly not their motive. Unless they are hiding their secrets extremely well I see no bigotry let alone paramilitarism in them.
“(with the help of Chief SuperDooper RUC man Breen)”
a contemptible and dishonest slur on a dead man without a shred of evidence is,of course, par for the course for Provos. Something to do with salving what passes for a conscience.
Perhaps Turgon is too charitable in attributing some decency to your posts. It seems a very sickly child, judging by this.
Willow, your post hard deserves recognition as it’s complete rubbish. Controls… then why did the UDR / RIR continue with some of the worst killings of the troubles up until Poyntzpass. You want me to be objective? Then get back to me with my earlier request to review the report on the UDR with you highlighting the positives about these thugs as cross community do-gooders?
“Actually, it replaced the B-Specialsâ€
actually, it was SUPPOSED TO REPLACE the disgraced B Special but signed up almost everyone from that brutal grouping of unemployables.
Turgon “…your language when describing especially the UDR is extremely one sided and involves blanket condemnation…â€
Of course it is. I have complete and total contempt for the UDR. As for one sided, why not – I’m not here to discuss the UDR as opposed to their opposition – I’m here to point out their bigotry and their murders which JEB considers just scrapping the barrel (what ever this measns). This isn’t a one side is as bad as the other discussion. We were talking about the ethnic cleansing in Ferm and moved to the UDR. I’m voicing my opinion
darth “…a contemptible and dishonest slur on a dead man without a shred of evidence is…”
yeah right. Breen was involved with the Gleanne Gang from the get go (see point 20, 21, 27, 28 & 29) …. http://www.seeingred.com/Copy/2.1_CODE_weiraff.html
Get back to me when you’ve finished reading the link and your first line should be “sorry, I didn’t know that Breen was involved in sectarian terrorism while a head of the RUC, it’s not usually written about in Unionist mediaâ€.
[see commenting policy - edited moderator]
1. edited by you Mick or one of the others? I know the posting policies & rules of this site; I followed them.
2. why was it edited? All the names I listed are in the public forum and published in Weir’s affadavit (for the public to read)? Therefore there’s no risk of suit against you and if anyone wanted to sue Weir they have to explain why it took them so many years to sue.
3. Most of the names mentioned are dead or were convicted of Glenanne Gang crimes (usually murder) so there no defamation involved.
“darth “…a contemptible and dishonest slur on a dead man without a shred of evidence is…â€
yeah right. Breen was involved with the Gleanne Gang”
Yawn. Not impressed
OK, I’ll insert the word “credible” into my sentence if it helps. A policeman convicted of MURDER after an investigation by his colleagues can hardly be given much credence when he then makes uncorroborated allegations against the force no matter how many Bibles he swears on.
Something to do with the fact that by committing serious crimes while serving as an upholder of the law just suggests a propensity to dishonesty, wouldn’t you think?
you may not find him credible but the honourable members of the judicary should (if someone had the guts to ask Weir to step into the witness box). They accepted the un corraborated words of the super-grasses back in the day didn’t they? Sauce for the goose and all that!!
but of course who would investigate before things went to court… shurely the RUC / PNSI? But wait some of them and or the cops as a whole would be the ones being investigated, oh what a tangled web they weave!!
and that’s why they got away with it for so long… “few bad apples” ? nah, rotten to the core.
Yawn, you were’nt meant to be impressed. I was hoping you’d take off your blinkers and realize why NI society is the way it is… original thinking and all that. Breen was a State Sponsored Terrorist w the rest of the Glenanne Gang – as shown by the affadivt of his co conspirator Weir !!
JEB
I don’t agree with much of what anonymous says but 1 thing is correct.
You asked him a direct question about condoning or condemning specific incidents and he answered it directly.
He asked you a direct question about specific incidents involving the UDR and you avoided it with pointless waffle about you knowing lots of UDR members and not one of them was sectarian (zzzz).
It’s amazing – you can meet lots of older people in France who were in the resistance or supported it. You never meet anyone who was a willing participant in the Vichy collaboration regime.
British figures have shown that the autorities knew of many strong links between many UDR members and “loyalist” paramilitaries. Indeed, in the 70′s the UDR was the single largest source of arm to “loyalist” paramilitaries.
Then we have the Glenanne gang, Miami Showband and the many UDR personnel who were imprisoned for sectarian crimes.
However, it’s amazing how all the posters like you on this site knew many, many UDR personnel and not one of them was anti-Catholic or sectarian in any way. These few anti-Catholic “bad apples” in the UDR/RIR must have been very busy indeed and never slept for years. In fact, in some cases they seem to have been in 2 or 3 places at once.
Your attempt at weaseling out of answering the question that anonymous posed
“I am sorry but this is way too infantile and boring for me”
is transparent and pathetic.
It is clear that you are either unwilling or unable to privide a direct answer to a direct question.
Your childish attempt at disguising this fact doesn’t fool anyone.
Darth,
You were right, I was rather too charitable. Anonymous may not be a supporter of the IRA but s/he seems to be incapable of ascribing any good motives to the UDR or RUC. Considering the level of vitriol heaped on these organisations and the venom with which s/he answers any unionist poster; one begins to wonder if s/he can ascribe any good motives to any unionists. Certainly unionist engagement seems not to be doing too well here.