“a special meeting of chairmen and secretaries of all clubs in the county.. as soon as possible”
The Chairman of the Fermanagh County Board of the GAA, Peter Carty, has issued a statement on behalf of the Board in relation to the sectarian abuse reported by Darren Graham recently. One paragraph, in particular, caught my eye
Darren Graham has been and continues to be a skilful exponent of football and hurling; he has made incredible efforts to be part of our games and has taken deep pride in representing Lisnaskea Emmetts. We are deeply upset that Darren has had to outline details of sectarian abuse to the Co. Board. We are also concerned at inaccurate and unfair media coverage of this issue. No player, no sportsman, no person should have to put up with such treatment and as a Co. Board we unreservedly apologise to Darren for any type of abuse he may have suffered on whatever occasion. Clubs or individuals who mete out any kind of abuse, including sectarian abuse, to others will be severely punished and such people are not welcome within our organisation.
The Chairman’s statement in full
We in the GAA, and in Fermanagh Co. Board in particular, have always taken pride in being a non-sectarian and non-political organisation. We unreservedly condemn abuse of any sort whether it occurs on or off the pitch and will not tolerate sectarian abuse of any of our members. In Fermanagh we have been especially proud of the fact that over the years many of the Protestant faith have given of their best to our games and have worn their club jersey with intense pride and continue to do so.
Darren Graham has been and continues to be a skilful exponent of football and hurling; he has made incredible efforts to be part of our games and has taken deep pride in representing Lisnaskea Emmetts. We are deeply upset that Darren has had to outline details of sectarian abuse to the Co. Board. We are also concerned at inaccurate and unfair media coverage of this issue. No player, no sportsman, no person should have to put up with such treatment and as a Co. Board we unreservedly apologise to Darren for any type of abuse he may have suffered on whatever occasion. Clubs or individuals who mete out any kind of abuse, including sectarian abuse, to others will be severely punished and such people are not welcome within our organisation.
We would want to apologise to any player who gives of his time, his energy and his commitment and is then subject to totally inappropriate remarks or treatment. We, in Fermanagh, make a promise to all our hard-working players, and members in general, that sectarian abuse or abuse of any sort towards them will never be tolerated and such behaviour will be rooted out. Referees, players and clubs are now on full alert with regard to such behaviour and severe penalties will ensue. Young people like Darren Graham deserve the highest praise for the effort they make, the hard work they put in and the endurance they show. We in the Co. board are behind them all the way; they have our unconditional support.
We have spoken with Darren who says that he would like to get on with his playing career encouraged as he is by the promises given. We are at the moment working very closely with him as regards his case and he is reassured that he and all players will be supported, protected and looked after to the very best of our ability.
We in Fermanagh Co. board and in the GAA are totally non-sectarian; we are open to all and we will not allow sectarian abuse to gain the slightest toe-hold within our organisation. With this in mind a special meeting of chairmen and secretaries of all clubs in the county will be convened as soon as possible to be addressed by leading GAA officials, including former Uachtarán of the Association Jack Boothman.
Peter Carty
Chairman
Fermanagh Co. Board
Well done to fermanagh county board.I hope that the issue is monitored and let this young man get back to hurling and that other kick and catch game in a completely positive way.
Well done Fermanagh (and that’s not a sentence you ehar every day). About as unequivocal as you can get and good to see that Darren Graham is thinking of continuing to play.
A welcome statement from the GAA Board in the county. It will be very important to have it followed by action which makes it clear that sectarian abuse has no place in Gaelic Games. It would be fantastic if Darren felt able to continue his GAA career, and he deserves the support of everyone involved in the GAA in Fermanagh and across Ireland.
There is a problem, though.
We in the GAA, and in Fermanagh Co. Board in particular, have always taken pride in being a non-sectarian and non-political organisation.
This is bunkum. The GAA is fundamentally both sectarian and political.
There’s nothing wrong with that per se (after all, Churches are both sectarian and political), but it needs to be clear about the facts of the matter, or the good words and intentions will be wasted.
The GAA prides itself on being political – so Peter Carty has shot himself in the foot .
After the initial dissembling and denial, this is a strong and unequivocal response from the Fermanagh board to Darren’s allegations, and very good to see. It might look cheesy to an outsider to make a specific nod of appreciation to Protestant GAA players, but in the context we live in here, it’s important and positive.
And it’s good to see Darren seems not to be prepared to let the bastards grind him down and wants to continue playing for his club,
Now, if only we could recruit a few more talented GAA-playing Prods in Greater Belfast, Antrim might actually turn out a decent football side. And pigs might fly…
IJP
I agree entirely that the GAA is fundamentally political. I’m not dure what the board were trying to achieve saying otherwise.
I don’t agree that it is fundamentally sectarian. A few of its members are sectarian bigots. Quite a lot probably have a few silly prejudices (like most of the rest of us).
But the organisation is not essentially religious at all. And since the political dimesnion is already covered in the word political, the reference to sectarian can only be assumed to apply purely religiously.
“But the organisation is not essentially religious at all.”
Not overtly or intentonally although there is i religious linkage thrugh the parish system – but Mick put it very well a few days ago on another thread.
” – Religion in Northern Ireland is highly correlative of political conviction, almost exclusively so in terms of the constitutional question. According to NILT, Protestant nationalists don’t exist. Ergo, this political requirement naturally filters almost all Protestants out. The pejorative term ‘black’ is equally applied to both ‘cop’ and ‘protestant’ – eg, ‘such and such a place is just a black hole’.
- This ideological filter is unique to GAA and, in Northern Ireland, it augments the kind of structural barrier (largely found in education) that also reduces (and almost eliminates) the number of NI Catholics who play rugby, hockey and cricket. So far as we know, it has successfully retarded the number of senior players in Fermanagh to one. As such, we know that few Protestants in Northern Ireland are prepared to sidestep that political obstacle in the way that many basically apolitical (at least viz a viz the constitution ) NI Catholics are. ”
http://sluggerotoole.com/index.php/weblog/comments/some-detail-on-that-abuse/P25/
One thing I’d like to ask for information – not to cause trouble, or imply anything – How does the Parish thing work out for protestant players – especially where Protestant and RC Parishes differ?
Cruimh
My understanding is that the parishs are simply useful geographical delimiters, rather like townlands.
Certainly i know several urban clubs NOT based on parishes at all.
and even where parish teams exist, plenty of people play for teams other than those representing where they live.
On the sectarian point, I don’t doubt the numerical correlation, but that is frankly an Ulster specific historical coincidence, and not one shared for example in ROI.
The key point remains that whatever principles of the GAA are detering people from that community, they are not religious ones. Is the NI Executive racist because it contains no people of minority ethnic origin? Only if it does so BECAUSE of that origin. Likewise the GAA.
“My understanding is that the parishs are simply useful geographical delimiters, rather like townlands.”
They define certain club eligibilities as outlined pages 17 and 18 – and transfers where parish priests may be involved – page 23 – the nit-picker in me was wondering – as there aren’t that many prods involved and as I think most times the parish boundaries are fairly similar, it may never even have arisen as yet.
http://www.gaa.ie/files/official_reports/og_part1_jan_2007.pdf
Also was wondering – there was something in toay’s Irish news about Parish changes in County Londonderry – which might affect player status ?
I know a few Irish americans who have read tonnes of books about Ireland, but ultimately they know fuck all about the place.
Similarly, it seems a lot of losers on here spend their days reading through the GAA hand book – ultimately they know fuck all about the GAA.
To be honest I have never seen a copy of the hand book in my 20+ years as a player.
One poster in particulr seems to keep a copy in his pocket for refernece, nit picking through clauses and subsections to find something to annoy him – parish priests making transfers – what hte hell are you on about? I suggest you just go to a few games to ‘understand the GAA’.
You won’t find the real GAA in a hand book.
Rulebook_charley
I haven’t had a copy of the Highway Code in my hands for 20 years either, it doesn’t mean I am not bound by the rules therein, ignorance is no defence.
So get out the rules by which you are governed and if any of them are not in keeping with the eschewing of politics or religion, if you feel that is the way the GAA should be run,then you should try to have them changed; don’t pretend they don’t matter, they do.
One question, why did it take Fermanagh County Board so long to react and issue a statement?
“We are also concerned at inaccurate and unfair media coverage of this issue.”
Good to see they’ve moved on this and so decisively, but they shouldn’t try to kid themselves or anyone else that the media invented any of it.
Seems unfair to criticise them for their tardy response – they are an amateur body and there’s obviously been a lot of thought put into this release.
Of course the GAA discriminates agiants Protestants despite the protests (!) here as matches are played on a Sunday.
From the GAA constitution:
“Irish paper shall be used for all official documents and correspondence” – I think that’s wonderful ! – How do they audit this !! Does Irish paper mean made from Irish trees or processed in Ireland ???
Seriously, good statement but perhaps “non-party political” would have been a better phrase. GAA political obviously.
The Beach Tree
I could come back here and argue:
a) sectarianism in itself is not the problem, it’s the bigotry that results from it that is;
b) political and religious amount pretty much to the same thing in NI in practice, despite all of our arguments to the contrary;
c) the GAA does constitutionally state a political preference.
But there are three PhD theses in those points… so for the sake of a good debate, I’ll concede your point with Cruith‘s and Dewi‘s amendments!
Fine words indeed from the County Board. Only a begrudger would not echo the sentiments.
I once heard David Trimble use a phrase “fine words butter no parsnips”, which I didn’t understand- like most of what he did actually.
So we have to hope this commendable statement actually produces results- not least from the player himself, clearly a confused man about whom I remain slightly cynical. I never bought the “apologise or I’m off” line- particularly if he never made a formal complaint. It seems a wee bit prima donna-ish. Either the behaviour convinced him a line had been crossed, or it was something to sort out internally.
He should now name and shame his abusers- how can a county, or an entire organisation, possibly be responsible for the actions of players it doesn’t know anything about? Of course if he did mention the problem informally to his own club, and they did nothing, he should confirm that too.
And if he was a marked man before, what will he be the next time he turns out- they’ll probably send a BBC outside broadcast unit down to cover the game! Of course he could be clever and get himself secretly miked up – like the ref at the Arsenal-Millwall game a decade ago- and then we’d all see if his claims are true- still couldn’t be as scary as Tony Adams shouting “Cheat!” in yer face.
Fair enough – they’ve put out a statement and should be congratulated for it, but it is a bit hard to understand how the GAA is completely non-sectarian and non-political.
Dont think we need to go through the list of things, but hunger-strike commmemorations using your grounds doesn’t really make a good start.
Also, not to get picky, but:
“In Fermanagh we have been especially proud of the fact that over the years many of the Protestant faith have given of their best to our games and have worn their club jersey with intense pride and continue to do so.”
Many of the Protestant faith have given their best…… Really? Find it hard to believe that more than a handful have ever played in Fermanagh, but I suppose we cant let that get in the way.
“and continue to do so”
Err,.. weren’t we told that Darran Graham was the only Protestant GAA player in Fermanagh at present, and given the fact that they’ve had to release this statement, doesn’t that actually mean that there aren’t any Prod players at the minute. So Protestants continuting to give their best is one thing Fermanagh GAA doesn’t actually have at the minute.
Apart from that though the statement is quite good!
To be heard on a field in Fermanagh : -
“Dont call him an orange b***ard! – ya big-nosed stupid ginger f**ker, or that other w***er will send you off – stick to marking your own man – get right up his arse like a gay b****rd”
Fair play to the – but I think refs (linemen, and umpires) should have the powers to send players off for foul and abusive language otherwise the problem will move to the next unfortunate.
name calling on the field
“The debate recalls the Bodyline series of 1932-33, when the English captain, Douglas Jardine, reportedly complained to his opposite number, Bill Woodfull, that an Australian player had called him a bastard.
Scanning the Australian dressing room, Woodfull asked his team: “Which one of you bastards called this bastard a bastard?” ”
( Daily Telegraph about Sledging)
brings to mind the story of the late great John Thompson, Celtic goalkeeper before the War, on his first visit to Ibrox for an Old Firm match. At halftime he was in the dressing room and spoke to Celtic veteran and legend Jimmy McGrory, saying how shocked he was at the abuse he was getting from the Rangers fans behind the goal, calling him a “Fenian bastard” etc.
McGrory said that he shouldn’t let it get to him – he (McGrory) had been had been subjected to that abuse for years.
Thompson-a Protestant- is supposed to have replied “It’s alright for you Jimmy-you are one!”
Good move from the GAA although it would have been nice to see them extend the net to include racism. There’ll have been a problem making sure that they don’t use language too reminiscent of that used by Sinn Fein in it’s ‘equality’ campaign and they seem to have avoided that.
The usual begrudgery will be there from the usual suspects but it’s nice to see some appreciation as well from sources where one wouldn’t have always expected it.
Let’s hope that they continue to recruit among all the New Irish, including all those who’s families have been on holiday here for the last few hundred years.
Excellent story Darth!
However you let your anti-Trimble prejudice get the better of you, with the butter and parsnips stuff.
I distinctly recall The Turtle stating “Talking never got the turf home.”
Blog request – can we have a blog on Gort na Mona GAC club hosting the Martin Meehan Hunger strike event? Antrim GAA and hunger strikes in the news again.
Good man Cruimh, it was beginning to feel like no mans land at Christmas 1914 there for a while.
Cruimh
That is right on the money. I am a GAA fan but i don’t subscribe to any of Meehans republican propaganda. I have no interest in the hungerstrikes.
I can accept that perhaps if GAA halls are the only local facilities that they could be used for community events etc but in the same token i wonder would Gort na Mona be so accomodating to the RUC Widows Association or FAIR etc.
I think the Casement Park case was a incident where the provo’s rode all over the GAA because the organisation was in the heart of republican West Belfast and as such should pay the same homage to the ‘boys’ as they expect from the rest of the population up there.
The GAA should have had the balls to say f*ck off and chained the gates.
Good response from the GAA, I suspect that this will only be the beginning. No decent organisation should put up with bigotry in their organisation. Sad that some on here don’t recognise decency, perhaps they can’t>, or more likely not in their agenda to do so.
Is this news ???? shock !sectarian organisation exhibits sectarian behaviour !. The GAA seriously needs to be proscribed.
Pounder “One question, why did it take Fermanagh County Board so long to react and issue a statement? “
I’d guess because a good statement is thought out, researched, reviewed, consulted about, thought about again and lastly delayed to let cooler heads prevail. “Off the cuff†is for those who garner info from (usually tabloid) headlines as opposed to well thougth out statements.
The Penguin “…but they shouldn’t try to kid themselves or anyone else that the media invented any of it. “
They never blamed the media or said the media invented the issue. Read what’s written and watch you don’t trip yourself up on your obvious agenda
interested “…weren’t we told that Darran Graham was the only Protestant GAA player in Fermanagh at present, …â€
I remember reading, when the initial report came out in the Fermanagh Herald, that D Graham said there were some who played who were from mixed marriages but he was the only one who was Protestant on both side… does it really matter ? Should there be a degree of genetic/religious make-up testing involved to play the game. Darren said that ‘as far as he knew†– maybe there’s more, maybe not… who cares it’s not an issue. Interested you’ve an obvious agenda.
Well done Darren, well done the club and the Fermanagh co board. Congrats all round to the GAA and hopefully they’ll use this incident to promote GAA further (as much in spite of the organizations knockers).
UP THE DUBS
Well done Darren ,if you are a good hurler consider a move to antrim ,that performance of ours against galway was sh-t
since the Darren Graham issue first came to light here in SluggerOToole world on the 1st Aug there have been 187 related postings to the original thread http://sluggerotoole.com/index.php/weblog/comments/protestant-gaa-player-gives-up-sport-after-sectarian-abuse/
On a following day another thread on the same subject http://sluggerotoole.com/index.php/weblog/comments/as-long-as-they-will-recognise-that-the-intimidation-is-going-on-for-so-lon/ generated 30 postings.
Thanksfully the issue seems to be coming to a resolution and altho this thread was posted yesterday we’ve only had 25 postings. I’d almost think that some would prefer the the bad ol’ days. Or is it that some with an agenda just wanted to ‘discuss’ the GAA as they appeared to be shown in a bad light. Those same don’t seem as proficient with the postings on this thread.
In a junior hurling game last week in Cork, a bit of a schimmozle broke out in the goalmouth. FB floored the opposing FF with a hook that would have done Ali justice in his hey-day.( Everything else was a bit of pushing and shoving ). Peace was quickly restored and ref, who was a bit away when it broke out, consulted his umpires while the FF was still being treated. As he struggled to his feet, still holding his jaw, the ref flashed the only card, a yellow , at the very sore FF and said out loud : ” Now, don’t ever again call someone a knacker while I’m around ” !
anonymous
“Or is it that some with an agenda just wanted to ‘discuss’ the GAA as they appeared to be shown in a bad light.”
The way you are talking you would think that Darren Graham’s complaints have just been proven beyond doubt that they were a figment of his imagination.
This changes nothing.
The issue remains why did it occur in the first place and go unchecked for years and the fact that this statement now has only been issued as a REACTION to the bad media coverage they received. Dont forget their initial reaction was along the lines of “we have received no formal complaint” and hence reserve the right to keep our heads in the sands.
This is a PR and damage limitation exercise.
Come back to me when the GAA have named a few people and given them a ban
“The issue remains why did it occur in the first place and go unchecked for years and the fact that this statement now has only been issued as a REACTION”
Neil Lennon anyone !!!
“This is a PR and damage limitation exercise”
I said, Neil Lennon anyone !!!
“Come back to me when the GAA have named a few people and given them a ban ”
A bit like the IFA ban on the thousands of bigots involved in the sectarian chanting at Neil Lennon.
tom
I think you are posting on the wrong thread ?
yes Tom, a very good and reasonable reply if you want to discuss sectarianism in sport in NI. You’ve shown how it shouldn’t be treated (ie. N Lennon) and how it should be defeated (ie. the procedure the the GAA is now engaging in).
“… why did it occur in the first place.. ”
because NI has an excess of bigots and sport has too many gobshites. It’s a pity that NI was misruled for years and therefore it’s society allow rot to the state it’s was in only up until a few years ago. It’s natural that a good player (assuming DG’s tormentors were good w the sliothar) is picked for many reasons other than his intellegence.
“…go unchecked for years…”
I don’t know if there was insults aimed at ALL the Protestant players for YEARS but this D. Graham case was dealt with as soon as it came to the notice of the organization. Your IMPLICATION is that the sectarianism evidence in the Graham case was rampant can’t be prooven altho can be disproven.
“…this statement now has only been issued as a REACTION…”
as opposed to not taking any proactive measures towards the Protestant population … eeerrr Nicky Brennan met w the Protestant heirarchy only a few months ago. Very public meeting and nationally reported announcements. What more do you want the GAA to do… award a Protestant team a four point advantage in every game ??
JEB, it’s obvious you just don’t like the GAA. Fine but don’t try hide it behind moralizing here on SluggerOToole.
It’s all good news on the GAA front today… hopefully it’ll be all good Dublin GAA news come Sat evening.
Ath Cliath abu
anonymous
“It’s a pity that NI was misruled for years and therefore it’s society allow rot to the state it’s was in only up until a few years ago.”
LOL !
Best Mope ever – 50 years of unionist mis rule now responsible for sectariansim in GAA !
The fact that the % of Protestants (and even fewer unionists) in the GAA must never have been greater than low single figures and the influence of Stormont over GAA in the period 1922 to date must have been negligible I think we can safely say that any inherent problems in the GAA are its own fault.
“I don’t know if there was insults aimed at ALL the Protestant players for YEARS but this D. Graham case was dealt with as soon as it came to the notice of the organization. Your IMPLICATION is that the sectarianism evidence in the Graham case was rampant can’t be prooven altho can be disproven.”
It was only dealt with after Darren Clarke said he could take no more and even then only after the spot light of media attention.
The key phrase “take no more..” – what does that say to you.
Indeed earlier this year he had his jaw broken.
Nothing was done.
The question remains if it will be a case of too little too late.
“What more do you want the GAA to do”
I want them to ban the offenders and possibly give the most serious ones a life time ban.
I want them to enforce their own rules that their facilities should not be used for political purposes so that next time Antrim GAA thumb their noses at them they are punished.
I also want the President to stop attending the opening of GAA Grounds named in honour of people who in both jurisdictions on this Island would have been considered as criminals.
I would also like them to say they are a purely sporting body which means that Nationalist, Unionist and Alliance Party are welcome and nowhere in its Constitution will it express a view on the constitutional position of Northern Ireland.
“JEB, it’s obvious you just don’t like the GAA”
I think your problem is you cant accept criticism
“I want them to ban the offenders and possibly give the most serious ones a life time ban.
I want them to enforce their own rules that their facilities should not be used for political purposes so that next time Antrim GAA thumb their noses at them they are punished.
I also want the President to stop attending the opening of GAA Grounds named in honour of people who in both jurisdictions on this Island would have been considered as criminals.
I would also like them to say they are a purely sporting body which means that Nationalist, Unionist and Alliance Party are welcome and nowhere in its Constitution will it express a view on the constitutional position of Northern Ireland.”
Amen to those – esecially the last point – especially in the light of the votes about the GFA on bth sides of the border.
The GAA should become a sporting and cultural body. As the theory is that fostering the language and games will in themselves strengthen nationalsism, why drive away the people you need to convert unless you don’t actually believe?
Re. RC parishes are only used in purely geographic terms … how come the local GAA club features heavily in my local RC parish magazine, and advertises for players in the entrance to the chapel?
There is no equivalent coverage in the local CofI magazine or CofI church. And I doubt in any other Protestant equivalents.
nope my mope was about NI – the shitehole of sectarism.
GAA and Stormont: the organization is Irish. Stormont was based on being anti-Irish/Catholic therefore an inherant aversion to the organization from supporters of the ‘failed entity’. Therefore unionist problem … not found in England as witnessed by the number of clubs ‘on your mainland’ !??!
I’m sure you didn’t mean Darren the golfer but Darren the hurler. An easy mistake when you deal in the name Darrens and ‘pigeon-holing’ as you seem apt to do !?!?
“It was only dealt with after Darren [sic] said he could take no more and even then only after the spot light of media attention. ”
AAhhhrrggg, what could the GAA do before learning about the complaint other than consult a crystal ball.
“Indeed earlier this year he had his jaw broken. ”
are you saying that he got his jaw brioken for being a Protestant player and this was one of his complaints? Or was his jaw broken as shit like this happens in the game and he never brought this up in his complaints about the abuse? Or are you trying to IMPLY that his jaw was broken because he was a Protestant altho Graham never complained that this a issue?
Your four points about what you;d like for the GAA to do would be given credence if you were anything but an obviously anti-GAA poster. The organization would probably address the political issues if their hand wasn’t forced in the manner described by Jack Boothman as …’ the British Army is probably the greatest recruiting agent for the Provos”. Your mentioned 4 suggestions only feature north of the border because of the pathetic society that the organization had to endure for so many years. The organization is addressing sectarianism like Brennan did months ago. It’ll be well able to resolve any of it’s MINOR issue. It a pity that it’s one of the few bodies in NI that will be able to do this.
Ath Cliath abu
GAA and Stormont: the organization is Irish. Stormont was based on being anti-Irish/Catholic …
Stormont was the Parliament of Northern IRELAND – hardly anti-Irish. Although I note you bring “Catholic” into the equation. Does this reveal your understanding of what “Irish” means?
The statement is welcome although rather inaccurate as has been pointed out many times in these posts but the simple fact is that there are few to no Protestants in the gaa in Fermanagh and this is unlikely to ever change.
I remember some weeks ago in an anti Orange Order thread when I criticised the gaa especially in Clones for supporters singing pro ira songs at games, I was criticised for making that statement. Again I will ask what is the gaa not just the Fermanagh gaa going to do about occurances like this?
anonymous
“nope my mope was about NI – the shitehole of sectarism”
The Irish problem and the GAA itself which arose from that problem predate the Northern Ireland State.
You will offend NI nationalists in addition to myself if you adopt that haughty southern attitude that you were above our problems.
Anyhow as for sectarianism it is only last year that the GAA gave up 19th century language and allowed ‘foreign’ sports to play in its stadium.
Not much monger before that it had ended its blatant and despicable apartheid against serving Northern Irish police officers.
But of course you are above all that are you not ?
“are you saying that he got his jaw brioken for being a Protestant player and this was one of his complaints?”
I am only quoting Darren myself when I heard his radio interview on Talk back last week. He talked about his abuse and also talked about his broken jaw – I got the impression he saw them linked.
“Your four points about what you;d like for the GAA to do would be given credence if you were anything but an obviously anti-GAA poster.”
Why – do you only listen to your friends ?
I think this quote sums both you and the GAA up very well. You only hear what you want to hear from your friends so that you can delude yourself that everything is ok.
You are living in denial and I am ctually doing you a favour by pointing these matters out to you.
If you wont listen then why be surprised when incidents like this occur.
JEB
Yes, there is a basic fallacy in the Nationalist re-writing of history here.
Nationalists constantly argue partition caused sectarianism.
Factually, it is the other way around.
The idea that the Republic of Ireland isn’t sectarian is as laughable as the idea that North Down isn’t. When the minority is so small, it’s very easy to be “holier than thou”.
John East Belfast “You will offend NI nationalists in addition to myself if you adopt that haughty southern attitude that you were above our problems.â€
I’m not here to offend people. However if I choose to speak in disgust about the sectarian, bigot – blighted six counties of less than 1mio people that is known thro out the world as a place of hate, then why not ?? Nice to see you choose to speak for the nationalists of NI too… I only speak for myself… who elected you as anyone’s representative?
“…it had ended its blatant and despicable apartheid against serving Northern Irish police officers.â€
A proper policy for a paramilitary force involved in state sponsored terrorism and not accepted by almost half the population. If we want to eradicate bigots from sports then the GAA was right to exclude the RUC.
“He talked about his abuse and also talked about his broken jaw – I got the impression he saw them linked.â€
A classic example of two and two equaling twenty two!!! Congratulations, you have won the prize for the most blatantly binkered posting of the month.
IJP “The idea that the Republic of Ireland isn’t sectarian is as laughable as the idea that North Down isn’t. When the minority is so small, it’s very easy to be “holier than thouâ€. “
I counter this with the fact that the Protestant’s in the Republic are more than favourably represented in the most lucrative professions. They are totally assimilated in most areas of society (strangely not many in the Dail, but they have FG & the PDs as a whole to represent them) such as sports, arts, literature. Their religion and churchs are plentiful and respected (Darth Rumsfeld-pisser- types are obviously limited to north of the border). They have the best of schools receiving public contribution vastly over and above what might be expected from per capita allocations.
IJP how often do you travel to the Republic? And what part?
ANONYMOUS
A proper policy for a paramilitary force involved in state sponsored terrorism and not accepted by almost half the population. If we want to eradicate bigots from sports then the GAA was right to exclude the RUC.
If the rationale of the ban on the police was that they were “a paramilitary force”, “engaged in terrorism”, “not accepted by almost half the population” and as a means to “eradicating bigots”, how come the GAA didn’t ban members of the Provisional IRA?
Anonymous
“if I choose to speak in disgust about the sectarian, bigot – blighted six counties of less than 1mio people that is known thro out the world as a place of hate, then why not ??”
Less than 2m actually unless of course it is only the Protestants you are describing ?
As for being known as a place of hate it is actually being courted as a potential example to the world of how solutions can be found.
Indeed the greatest examples of hate that I can see here are your postings and your last one especially.
You must be a southern nationalist as your would be an embarassment to your northern brethern
“If we want to eradicate bigots from sports then the GAA was right to exclude the RUC.”
What every member of the RUC – including all the Catholics who served were bigots ?
And you saying this in a thread talking about a Protestant having to leave the GAA because of bigots ?
Also what about an answer to Willowfield’s post about why the GAA did not ban PIRA as per your definition ?
“I counter this with the fact that the Protestant’s in the Republic are more than favourably represented in the most lucrative professions. They are totally assimilated in most areas of society (strangely not many in the Dail, but they have FG & the PDs as a whole to represent them) such as sports, arts, literature. Their religion and churchs are plentiful and respected (Darth Rumsfeld-pisser- types are obviously limited to north of the border). They have the best of schools receiving public contribution vastly over and above what might be expected from per capita allocations.”
All I can say is that if Protestants were black that last post could have been written by someone talking about the native elite in colonial Africa.
And LOL you still cant see why the GAA has problems with people like you involved !
As for IJP visiting the Republic how often do you visit NI because you clearly know little about the place.
“As for being known as a place of hate it is actually being courted as a potential example to the world of how solutions can be found. “
a pig with lipstick is still a pig!!
The parents of T. Devlin don’t seem to be too happy with Bertie’s ‘Pay Off the Sectarian killers solution’ that you seem so happy to promote… http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/northern_ireland/6943137.stm
“You must be a southern nationalist as your would be an embarassment to your northern brethern “
Again you speak for northern nationalists – amazing. Yes I’m from the 26 cos. Why would I be an embarrassment… and WTF is ‘brethren’ in the context of northern nationalists !?!?
“Indeed the greatest examples of hate that I can see here are your postings and your last one especially.â€
I don’t see much hate in my posting but you must hate the following… A classic example of two and two equaling twenty two!!! Congratulations, you have won the prize for the most blatantly binkered posting of the month.
“What every member of the RUC – including all the Catholics who served were bigots ? “
the RUC, in general, was a bigoted organization so much so that it didn’t receive support from almost half the population. It has been under almost constant investigation (internally) for almost 20 years. It’s highest ranked member killed in the Troubles (Chief Inspector Harry Breen) was linked to the Glenanne Gang /mass murderers (http://www.seeingred.com/Copy/2.1_CODE_weiraff.html). So while every member of the RUC prob wasn’t a bigot the percentage of bigots in the organization allows for me to describe it as such.
“Also what about an answer to Willowfield’s post about why the GAA did not ban PIRA as per your definition ? ”
I can’t image that any potential new member of CLG when signing up filled out ‘member of the IRA’ in the line for occupation. Therefore I can’t image that the GAA would have known which member was part of that secret organization. The RUC on the other hand, falsely portrayed themselves as guardians of the peace and upstanding members of the community and their occupation would have been filled out in their applications.
“All I can say is that if Protestants were black that last post could have been written by someone talking about the native elite in colonial Africa. “
IJP said that the Protestants in ROI were discrimated against. I point out and list that they’re not and for a minority have done exceptionally well (per capita). What the heck are you writing about ? Discriminated against … and you want to be compared w the rich Blacks in SA’s – where’s the rationale in that ?
“As for IJP visiting the Republic how often do you visit NI because you clearly know little about the place. ”
Way, way too often (mainly west of the Bann, occasionally the tourist hot spot of Portadown and from time to time shopping in Belfast) … send me your address and I’ll call round for a chat the next time I’m in town. Oh, you forgot to include where you visit in ROI…(waiting for yours and IJP’s answer)