I see that an academic wants to redevelop the Waterfront area of Belfast, to include a new Parliament building. The Newsletter’s page three has a map of the proposed design, which unless my geography is deficient, will involve turning the Short Strand into a train station.
World by Storm has a nice piece up on the IRA’s role in helping MK, the armed wing of the ANC, in the 1980s. In particular he sees a strange alchemy at work there: …if one can think of a clearly legitimate contemporary struggle it was that against apartheid and it is to the credit [...] read our review »
A moment of some significance in journalism perhaps, as the New York Times reviews the current talked about book, The Wrong War: Grit, Strategy, and the Way Out of Afghanistan by Bing West. The author is no bleeding heart but a former assistant Defense Secretary from the Reagan era who stomped his way round the Afghan [...] read our review »
3,000 people in Short Strand being moved out of their century-old community to satisfy the designs of some academic. Yeah right…
It’s often been said that many academics have a less tenuous grasp of real-life. This maybe proves the point…
As for the train station proposal, Central Station is only 100 yards away from his proposed train station site in Short Strand ! Has anyome told him…??
Surely it would make more sense using the lower Newtownards Road area as the train station site. Its full of empty houses, large areas of waste ground & empty shops.
Whilst I would not wish to see a new parliament building, I would dearly love to see the Short Strand demolished.
Ziznivy, would you acre to clarify your remarks re the Short Strand?
Sorry – typo, obviously that is ‘care to qualify your remarks’
Reds, not particularly. It seems fairly self-explanatory.
It’s not really self explanatory. Were it so, I would not have asked you to clarify your remarks.
I feel that batter use could be made of the Short Strand area by demolishing it and building something else. A shiny new train station need not necessarily be my preference. Perhaps a multi-sports atadium!
So we should just go around knocking down working class communities, because people think we could build something new and shiny their? Hmmm. Ok. What do we do about the 1000 plus people who live there? Just turf them out?
Rehouse them somewhere where they are less unsightly.
That said, I would prioritise knocking down the village.
‘Rehouse them somewhere where they are less unsightly’
Sums up the new breed of n.i football supporter.
Just the same old sectarian bigotry, how sad.
The Village is a loyalist area.
“Turning the Short Strand into a train station” – sounds good to me. While we’re at it how about similarly demolishing the Markets, Donegall Pass, the Village, Sandy Row and all of the other anachronistic pockets of ‘working’ class vermin throughout the city. How dare these scum expect to live within walking distance of the city centre without working or behaving in a civilised, law-abiding fashion.
Have I missed something? Don’t we already have a Parliament building?
Do we really want something ghastly like the monstrosity at the bottom of the Royal Mile in Edinburgh?
“‘working’ class vermin”
“How dare these scum expect to live within walking distance of the city centre without working or behaving in a civilised, law-abiding fashion.”
As one of these ‘vermin’ and ‘scum’ who has lived my entire life in working class communities and have lived in one of these communities for 15 years that people now propose bulldozing. I would like to point out, I work, I am a private property owner and have no criminal record. Are those who don’t fit the stereotyping permitted to stay?
Maybe you really buck the trend and don’t expect oppotunities and employment to be parachuted to your door, just because you’re part of a “community”.
“”‘working’ class verminâ€
“How dare these scum expect to live within walking distance of the city centre without working or behaving in a civilised, law-abiding fashion.â€
As one of these ‘vermin’ and ‘scum’ who has lived my entire life in working class communities and have lived in one of these communities for 15 years that people now propose bulldozing. I would like to point out, I work, I am a private property owner and have no criminal record. Are those who don’t fit the stereotyping permitted to stay?”
I would have thought the answer was obvious from my post FD – of course you can stay. My objection is to the use of my taxes to subsidise the housing of work-shy, criminal and invariably sectarian scum within desirable areas of Belfast.
That said, I would prioritise knocking down the village.
Yep, just to prove you’re not a bigot!
3,000 people in Short Strand
site in Short Strand
You left out the definite article. Are you an American, macswiney?
“I would have thought the answer was obvious from my post FD – of course you can stay. My objection is to the use of my taxes to subsidise the housing of work-shy, criminal and invariably sectarian scum within desirable areas of Belfast.”
Hear hear.
“Yep, just to prove you’re not a bigot!
”
Certainly not. It’s because I live closer to the Village and have more ample opportunity to experience the unique “culture” of the area.
Ziz
IIRC the owner-occupation rate in the area is at 50%, the economically active outnumber the inactive by almost 2:1 and the area also has a low crime rate. So it would appear that I do not buck the trend.
ziznivy (owen)
You were banned from the owc site for making vile commemts about disabled kids.
Crawl back under your rock.
My objection is to the use of my taxes to subsidise the housing of work-shy, criminal and invariably sectarian scum within desirable areas of Belfast.
Isn’t it fascinating how the perception of a bit of easy money made on the property market has turned members of a previously productive, cultured, constructive social class into a shower of stuck-up bigots?
Bemused
Thank you for the clarification. I am afraid it was not “obvious” as your comment was a blanket prescription in terms of how area’s and residents were to be dealt as made explicit in the comment below:
“While we’re at it how about similarly demolishing the Markets, Donegall Pass, the Village, Sandy Row and all of the other anachronistic pockets of ‘working’ class vermin throughout the city.”
Wrong Mark. I made no comments about disabled kids, as you presumably very well know. I made comments about a bunch of vile, drunken, homunculous female Linfield fans from Dungannon.
ziznivy (owen)
‘You were banned from the owc site for making vile commemts about disabled kids. Crawl back under your rock.’
Mark, maybe ziznivy is the secretary of the Norn Iron branch of:
THE BORIS JOHNSON FAN CLUB
http://www.geocities.com/borisjohnsonfanclub/
“Isn’t it fascinating how the perception of a bit of easy money made on the property market has turned members of a previously productive, cultured, constructive social class into a shower of stuck-up bigots?”
Huh?
I genuinely don’t understand what you’re trying to say. Are you trying to say that I’m a member of a ‘previously productive, cultured, constructive social class’ (i’d be interested to know which social class this is) and am now a stuck up bigot? How am I ‘stuck up’? How am I a bigot? I dislike work-shy, feckless, criminal and sectarian people. I particularly dislike paying for them to live in the centre of the city in which I live. What’s the problem with that? What does any of this have to do with “the perception of a bit of easy money made on the property market” (whatever that mouthful means)?
‘I particularly dislike paying for them to live in the centre of the city in which I live’
As many of the people in the areas mentioned are home owners and working, it does make you sound like a complete twat.
’I particularly dislike paying for them to live in the centre of the city in which I live’
As many of the people in the areas mentioned are home owners and working, it does make you sound like a complete twat.
How so George? Perhaps you haven’t read my response to FD – I’ve no problem with working, responsible, law-abiding people living wherever the hell they want. How does that make me a twat?
Hint: When Newton Emerson does his eat the poor routine he gets away with it because he has the gift of humour. When you mirthless snobs do it you just seem like arrogant hatemongers.
(Emerson if you are reading look what you have done, these people now think it’s clever to hate the poor. All your fault. A piece on humourless angry mongs being vermin may redress the balance.)
“Hint: When Newton Emerson does his eat the poor routine he gets away with it because he has the gift of humour. When you mirthless snobs do it you just seem like arrogant hatemongers.
(Emerson if you are reading look what you have done, these people now think it’s clever to hate the poor. All your fault. A piece on humourless angry mongs being vermin may redress the balance.)”
Jesus – this is getting tiresome. I don’t hate ‘the poor’, I hate criminal, irresponsible, sectarian, work-shy scum.
A couple of months back, I jokingly suggested that the Folk on the Hill could move out to facilitate the need for a new, secure US Embassy to the UK (see http://redfellow.blogspot.com/2007/05/malcolms-modest-proposal-it-seems-us.html).
I also suggested that the Assembly could be relocated in the proposals for the Titanic Quarter, equally less than seriously.
It is now evident that:
1. The Assembly is not going to hit the rocks, or be iced up (my previous assumption);
2. The Stormont buildings are too grandiose (and always were): we don’t want to give this lot airs and graces.
3. Why Short Strand, for heaven’s sake?
4a. Somer of Harvard: yeah, oodles of local knowledge there.
4b. Bloody academics should sort out their own problems first: why not an expansion of Higher Education to cope with the 30-odd per cent excess of students forced to leave NI because of inadequate provision? A second Higher Education facility in the Belfast area, and preferably in the northern part of town? Hell’s teeth: give ‘em the Stormont building, nice, prestigious, and good for all that academic flummery with gowns, hoods and funny hats. If not (and assuming increased, improved provision in the west of the territory), where else?
5. Any moment now, on the basis of other UK cities, we can expect gentrification to set in, even through the more unlikely areas, thus threatening working-class communities. An Trá Ghearr is sooo convenient, dontcha know? Then you really would need a peace-line.
Beyond the usual sniping, there are serious issues here, and they need addressing.
‘I hate criminal, irresponsible, sectarian, work-shy scum.’
bemused
I suggest you check the Asset Recovery Agency website, the criminal,irresponsible, sectarian, work-shy scum’ tend to have nice big houses out of town.
Many of the thieves, smugglers ,racketeers & work-shy probably live in your area.
Although they are probably not keen living next to a twat.
“’I hate criminal, irresponsible, sectarian, work-shy scum.’
bemused
I suggest you check the Asset Recovery Agency website, the criminal,irresponsible, sectarian, work-shy scum’ tend to have nice big houses out of town.
Many of the thieves, smugglers ,racketeers & work-shy probably live in your area.
Although they are probably not keen living next to a twat.
Posted by george on Jul 02, 2007 @ 03:00 PM”
Nice considered response George. The point which you seem incapable or unwilling to see is that I object to PAYING for workshy, criminal, sectarian scum to live in close proximity to the city centre – geddit?
Please knock the insults on the head, play the ball not the man.
Faor Deal,
I agree entirely. I am not sure if some of the posters are serious or tongue in cheek. If they are serious some of this is a bit insulting.
As an upper middle class Prod I do not particularly like paying for feckless criminal people but as far as I can see they seem to be in a small minority in the Village, or for that matter in Short Strand.
The really sad thing is that a lot of people in some working class areas have been terrorised for too long by paramilitaries et al. and we the “nice” people have tended to ignore the problem. The depravation some of the elderly residents of the Village live in has been shown recently and horrified me especially as I lived for some time on the gentrified Lisburn Road a couple of hundred yards away.
Bemused,
[i]The point which you seem incapable or unwilling to see is that I object to PAYING for workshy, criminal, sectarian scum to live in close proximity to the city centre – geddit?[/i]
So sad, too bad.
I object to PAYING for workshy, criminal, sectarian scum to live in close proximity to the city centre – geddit?
3 questions Bemused:
1. Do you work in the public sector?
2. Did you contribute this gem on work time?
3. You are an insufferable bigoted twat.
(sorry that last one was a statement)
No On The Turn – I’m self-employed and work fucking hard. You?
‘I’m self-employed and work fucking hard. You? ‘
You have spent the whole day on slugger, was today your day off ?
This Harvard academic couldn’t even pronounced the word “quay” on the radio this morning.
Who asked him to do this study?
Why does it have to be in Belfast? There is a great site in a field just outside Lisburn complete with a shrine to our modern history. Railway is not too far away and Hillsborough Castle just up the road.
The Maze would be a great location for a new assembly building
Great road links, close to the city & accessable to all the people of n.i.
On second thoughts, it sounds like the ideal location for a sports stadium.
Probably the worst thread on Slugger in 2007.
Has anyone responded to the actual thread?
Personally I think it’s a load of bollox and the tax-payers shouldn’t stand for the folks on the hill squandering another few hundred million.
I am absolutely sick of the people in this country. Any time that someone tries to suggest improvments theres always the usual complaining and then comments from people that think the increasingly catholic Belfast shouldnt be getting the money and that it should go to Lisburn!!!??? – Lisburn is a suburb of Belfast, just let it go. Why oh why cant this country after having been kicked to the ground for decades allow itself to have something nice. We deserve it and Belfast in particular does – Its our Capital and the economic pioneer and saviour of our country!
The feckless, as they have been described, form a segment of most communities. They will remain feckless even if the community they live it is dispersed, they are just going to be feckless with a different address.
Maybe “Bemused” is from Craigavon.