Here we go.

No laughing please.

Six County Policing

395. This Ard Fheis calls for the creation of the new beginning to policing, in accordance with the principles of the Good Friday Agreement. A key requirement in this is democratic accountability. In the Six Counties, this requires the transfer of powers on policing and justice away from London and out of the hands of British securocrats to restored, democratically elected institutions in Ireland. The Sinn Fein President will propose to the Sinn Fein Ard Chomhairle that it calls a special Ard Fheis to decide Sinn Fein�s position on new policing arrangements in the context
of:

� Agreement between the parties on the departmental model and powers to be transferred;
� The enactment by the British government of the legislation to give full expression to this transfer of powers on policing and justice away from London;
� A DUP commitment to an acceptable timeframe for the transfer of powers on policing and justice.
� A position paper would go to all levels of the party for discussion to inform a comprehensive debate leading up to the special Ard Fheis.Unquote

Now when you add the public comments over MI5`s role you have some shopping list. lets see what Gerry has in his bag?

Nite

Martin

After the 1981 hungerstrikes ended in a stalemate the more pragmatic and realist (!) Republican prisoners embarked on a strategy of agitation from within and proceeded to move off the protest blocks into the conforming wings.

A lesser known fact is that in prison, as with any society or social enterprise, the system only works with the tacit consent of all the players involved. So for all our rhetoric and even the most staunch, yes even we prisoners, at some level, consented (albeit against or wishes and desires) to accept the reality (escapes aside) of the situation to being imprisoned.

One major goal was, by agitation, gile, intelligent leadership and resolve to improve the quality of lives of the Republican jail community to the extent that we had the freedom from brutality from the screws and loyalists and the security to best function as Republicans, to persue our own education programme in a peaceful non-confrontational lifestyle that enabled us to grow and evolve as men, as republicans and as political activists preparing for our eventual release and return to the struggle.

Over a decade later by August 1999 we had 100% defacto Poltical status, we ran our own communities, we had our own internal education programmes including a gaeltacht in H-block 5, coupled with access to formal educational opportunities that I personally availed of to Masters level. In all life was bearable, we made the very best of what we had improving ourselves and our conditions as was our duty.

I am aware, from personal experience and activism, that many of the present SF strategists and activists like Adams, Gibney, Duckser (?) Storey, Sid, Lorney, Jackie, Raymond et al went through that jail exprience and now favour the SF strategy derived from this model that change from within is the optimum way to implode the system and make ‘A better Quality of life’ for our communites.

I mean it stands now like then, why should Republicans and future generations suffer more than is necessary to make gains, to reclaim our rights, ? And hey, make gains we likely will, gan doubt, a lot of us have got the nice cars and nice houses (some even more than one) and a reasonable quality of life. Logical, common sense, straightforward yes?

Yet crucially, while never giving up on our identity, our Republican ideals, a desire to escape and the tools to make that happen, we were still in JAIL !!!

And now to transplant that model on the outside in terms of the national question? Partition? Soveregnity is folly at best, criminal at worse.
We are not in a physical jail any more men, we can choose not to be forced to conform and convince ourselves its for some higher ideals like we had to in the kesh. We can revolt, we can unite and decide to resist the ‘riot teams’ on our own terms now, its no longer 24 against one. We can stand together, resolute and firm, where did the young, defiant, brave Storeys and Walshes go? !!

Comrades despite the gloss and glam are we not still in a Jail of sorts? Our escape kits and escape commitees have been meekly decommisioned and disbanded with Sid & Storey leading the charge, Republican ideals thwarted and sidelined for the foreseeable future by former comrades as we are effectively being told to ‘do our wack’ while we are led ‘boots squeeking’ into the ‘prison’ system endorsing British rule in Ireland.

This Adams/Maguinness driven internal implosion strategy has made Irish Republicanism unrecognisable to itself.

In conceeding its core beliefs to get into the ‘general population’ and presenting the delusion that the 6 county ‘jail’ can be smashed from within by the outside equilalent of board forms and NIO petitions they now have the audacity to ask us to support the PSNI?

I remind you with gritted teeth and steely resolve tempered by years of prison struggle and activism since my release to any comrades reading this that never, not once, not one of us, in all that time would have considered encouraging our people, our families and ourselves joining the Northern Ireland Prison Service !!!

Shame, shame, shame on those former comrades like Bobby Storey, Séanna Walsh and Phil Mc Cullagh who now call on us to accept the authority of the public face of our Goalers, of the occupation the PSNI and MI5.

This is not over by any means, infiltrate yes !!! Join, support and collude with them against your own? Impossible for any genuine Republican !!

… the British still occupy our nation in collusion with the present Sinn Féin project which quisling like bequeaths the struggle to future generations and their revenge will be the slaughter of our children !!!

is mise
Fuiseog

I am not saying that at all Mickhall.

I am indeed encouraged by the leadership people that I have spoken to. I am simply stating that these proposals have not gone far enough for Republicans to be able to sign up to policing.

I am also saying that were the Ard Chomhairle to call a special Ard Fheis on the strength of these proposals, which I don’t believe that they will, then they will find a very considerable section of the party oppossed.

This is not like other issues that Republicans have had to face, this is perhaps the biggest.

As far as I can tell the RoI does not demand of its politicians that they sign up in support of the police, nor does the rest of the UK. Political Parties can choose for themselves whether they sit on committees that oversee the police. [such committees are hollow beings anyway, ra ra committees, "ain't the cops great" type of things]

Chris,

What you seem to be saying is the leadership of your Party is out of step with the membership and not for the first time I might add. What we have seen from the rank and file membership since 1997 is when this happens, instead of pulling your leaders into line, you acquiesce to there demands by putting a peg on the nose and swallowing hard. Then you tell the rest of us that leadership is all about making tough decisions.

You remind me in this of the British Labour Party membership, who allowed Blair to do something very similar when he filleted that party of its core beliefs in there mad desire for political power. The end result has been the wasted and shameful years of the NL Blair governments; and their disgusting military adventures abroad.

As to the LP, it is a shadow of its former self having lost over half of its membership. I would remind you a majority of these activists have gone home and shut there door, lost to political activity. Which should be a warning for SF as this is what many of its members who leave the party are also doing.

If SF does not wish to go the same way, perhaps it is time you considered drawing that line in the sand and stating to Mr Adams enough, no more!

Maura,

I feel you are getting things confused, it would be perfectly acceptable for SF to accept the writ of the PSNI, but support them? work to make them more efficient?
Others can do this if they wish, the job of Republicans or any political radicals come to that, is to keep the PSNI in check, to expose them when they cross the line and fight to bring them to account.

Best regards to you both.

You are nothing more than a stirrer, you are a spook. What’s more you crave media attention so much that your claims become even more desperate by the day.

Get a life!

Mick

There is not a chance in hell that the Ard Chomhairle will call a special Ard Fheis on the strength of these current proposals. We have not even reached the standard whereby it would be constitutional to call an Ard Fheis. Unquote

The above comment really made me smile and yet whince at the smame moment.He really does live in an isolated world, a world that he does not understand or indeed comprehend. This issue is dealt with and the Ard Fheis will happen of that be in NO DOUBT, only those who truly do not understand Sinn Fein would believe otherwise.

Chris, it is time you grew up mate and smell the coffee, Breakfast is nearly over!.

Martin

But we also have had Sinn Fein TDs saying that while they accept An Garda Siochana and Oglaigh na hEireann (the one President McAleese is head of) as the legitimate forces of the Irish state they would not urge the public to help investigators tracking down murderers of Gardai.

Sinn Fein may think this book is closed but they still have a long way to go on this matter.

Simply saying something at an Ard Fheis doesn’t mean this is the reality on the ground.

Support means being horrified when you see elected officials being photographed with Garda killers, who also fired on unarmed Gardai. Support doesn’t mean being the elected official in the photograph.

Is Sinn Fein’s primary loyalty to former comrades or to the Irish state?

This still isn’t clear I’m afraid regardless of what Gerry Adams says.

Unless it commits total and unswerving loyalty to the Irish state and its institutions, it can still be construed as an enemy of the Irish state.

Gerry Adams coming out and saying such killings have no place in the Republican struggle aren’t good enough.

If Sinn Fein doesn’t bite the bullet on policing soon, it’s facing a huge crisis south of the border in my view.

If Sinn Fein really is an all-Ireland party then it will have to address this.

How is up to you.

Apparently not clear enough, and the PSNI situation provides enough ammo for further confusion. And SF gets hammered on law and order in the SDouth at the moment.

Something prominent in the elction platform would be a must at least.

Now maura, that’s not what I said )

That would be a waste of Ard Fheis time, it is there to debate/amend/change party policy. It is not there to support existing party policy.

I can see where you are coming from kensei but you risk such a motion being ruled out of order for the very reasons that I have outlined above.

Gerry Adams made it very clear at last years Ard Fheis what our policy is towards the Gardaí.

Interesting…… yet naive and delusional.
I like that!

all of those you mention.

The PSNI poses difficulty for Nationalists.

If it is accepted, inherent in it is a partitionist police force. Nationalists don’t fundamentally accept that there should be 2 states, and state police forces in Ireland.

If it is rejected, an elephant enters the sitting room in the form of the PSNI. An elephant that offers jobs, has increasingly shown fair play, and looks like being accepted by the next generation.

Ignoring elephants in sitting rooms is never a sound medium term option.

Unionists located in a corner of Ireland, with the Union melting away, could secretly attest to that.

But lots of people don’t know or are unsure. Stick something through the Ard Dheis anyway. Done right it’s free PR in an election year.

The 10th November deadline is for all parties, not those who might have lent their votes to individual parties, but for the parties and their memberships themselves to endorse or not the St Andrews Agreement.

Whether an Ard Fheis has been held by that stage or not, the SF party leadership will give an answer to that question to the governments.

If it’s not a definitive answer then there are likely to be problems for the changes in legislation to adapt the current 24th November deadline for the Assembly.

That’s the current dilemma for ‘the leadership’.. and why Ian Paisley has suggested that they might need more time..

A ‘maybe’ probably isn’t going to be enough.

Chris, true enough, but it is a two way street and SF looks to its voters, testing their mood and decisions are made accordingly- that is the very essence of politics.

A bitter person who has seen his/her party crumble by the wayside just as the Empire did and just as his beloved “Norn Iron” will as well.

Our voters look to the party for leadership, that is the nature of politics.

Is it worth losing every advance we have made over this?

I don’t believe that we will lose anything, if we accept a police force that has not changed and can’t be changed enough then we risk losing a lot more.

I welcome the opportunity to thrash them out.

As do I maura