GAA Board grants ground to Hunger Strike rally
The Antrim GAA Board has granted permission for its Casement Park ground to be used for a Hunger Strike Rally. Casement Park received a substantial funding package for improvements in 2000 including support from Making Belfast Work, the Sports Council and European Peace funds. Does this non-sporting and political use of the facilities improved by public monies breach grant conditions?















harpo: “I’d presume he would be of the same opinion in this case. If the GAA acts in this manner – supporting commemorations of IR terrorists – then that is going to attract the attention of crazy loyalists who will see the GAA as a legitimate target as a result. ”
That still does not address his seeming endorsement of the targetting, demonstrated by the “quite rightly” in his original statement.
Keith’s origonal statement was open to sinister interpretation but he has clarified his position subsequently has he not?
‘Do unionists here think the GAA is sectarian/the IRA at play throughout Ireland or only in Northern Ireland?’
tyrone fan:
The GAA is sectarioan anywhere it exists. It makes no bones about the fact that it is an Irish nationalist organization. Now that may manke no difference to anyone in the ROI, where there are no unionists, but it’s a big thing in NI.
If you are a unionist, I don’t see how you can have anything to do with the GAA.
Is it PSF/PIRA at play? In some places – mostly in NI – it’s obviously openly pro-Irish Republican, as evidenced by clubs being set up in honour of IR terrorists, or kids tournaments being named in honour of them, or GAA personalities openly endorsing that hunger-strikers shirt, or in this case the Antrim GAA board allowing a hunger-strike commemoration. I don’t see any other explanation for this behaviour, other than enough people at these clubs or organization levels being pro-IR terrorism.
And if that’s the case, and higher authorities are scared to do anything about it, then it’s fair to say that some parts of the GAA are openly pro-IR, and the rest of it is willing to allow this to continue. Which makes them complicit in allowing this activity to go on.
‘Adults and young people enjoy the games and are not required to subscribe to, or marry, a particular religion.’
John Mitchell:
No, but they are required to believe in Irish nationalism. That’s sectarianism.
‘It must have taken at least some effort for this story to have been earthed.’
Well, when sectarian organizations come straight out in support of commemorations of IR terorism, that is news.
I’m sure you’d rather that the focus was kept on the sport, but unionists in general don’t care about the sport. But they do care when part of this supposedly sporting organization once again demonstrates the sectarianism imherent in the organization.
‘I should be amazed at the reactions of unionist contributors to this thread, so knee jerk. The level of political thought is so simple.’
The level of political thought is simple because you don’t need anything other than simple thought to get the point here.
A GAA county board has approved the use of GAA facilites by some group that wants to commemorate dead IR terrorists.
How much more simple does it get?
And why ‘should’ you be amazed at the reaction of unionists? Didn’t you know that we unionists always complain about these commemorations of dead IR terrorists? If you didn’t know about this then where have you been living?
‘OK so some clubs and members visibly support the RM. So what?’
So what? So…GAA HQ allows this, so any pretense that support for violent Irish Republicanism doesn’t exist within the GAA is a plain lie, as are the claims that the GAA provides sport for everyone, as are the claims that GAA HQ is against such activity.
Can’t you see what you ‘so what?’ comment implies? You may say that anyone is welcome into the GAA, but that’s nonsense. If a young Protestant was thinking of investigating playing GAA sports, and then finds out that his local club was started in honour of the 1981 hunger-strikers, how do you think that might affect his thinking?
Can you name any other sporting organization in the world that allows open support for terrorists via the naminmg of clubs and tournaments?
The IFA doesn’t. Can you imagine the fuss that there would be if a soccer club started up and was dedicated to the memory of the Shankill Butchers? Would an answer of ‘so what?’ be accpetable there?
‘I don’t recall my local soccer or cricket clubs raising anything.’
John Mitchell:
But then members of their sports probably weren’t involved in carrying out the Omagh bombs, were they?
‘I disagree with shinners naming clubs after hunger strikers etc, it sends out a wrong message and it’s frustrating, but honestly the GAA isnt as bad as people are making out.’
tyrone fan:
If that’s the case, then why does the rest of the GAA put up with Shinners doing this stuff?
This stuff is what reinforces the impression that unionists have of the GAA, so if ‘the GAA’ (as an entity) was really interested in cleaning up its image, it would do something about this nonsense.
So why doesn’t GAA HQ do something about this obvious support for IR terrorists? If it continues to do nothing, then all that be assumed is that GAA HQ and the silent majority of other GAA people are quite content with the IR supporting element in their midst.
And I’ll file your ‘but honestly the GAA isnt as bad as people are making out’ right up there with OO supporters who say exactly the same: ‘but honestly the Orange Order isnt as bad as people are making out’.
Your message is exactly the same as theirs – ‘never mind the disturbing facts, it’s really not that bad’.
‘It wouldn’t matter what the GAA did, it wouldn’t be good enough for some. So be it.’
John M:
I’d say the problem at the moment is that the GASA does NOTHING.
I see you are back to the MOPEry, in the style of the PIRA defenders. “It doesn’t matter what we do, it will never be good enough’.
That of course just means you don’t want to do anything.
All I have to say is that if the GAA wishes to continue to stew in its own juices, it is perfectly welcome to do so. The GAA is a nationalist organization, and if on top of that it wants to allow open support for IR terrorism, it is free to do so. I really don’t care what it does.
But so long as it allows this, it will come under attack as being part of the problem of sectarianism, and not part of any solution.
“So let’s not get the impression that it is an OK organization if it isn’t openly celebrating IR terrorists. Even if it isn’t doing that, it reamins a pro-Irish nationalist organization, and is thus sectarian.”
Posted by harpo on Jul 30, 2006 @ 04:12 PM
By your definition of sectarianism Harpo almost the whole world of Nationalism is sectarian. I am certainly guilty of standing for “flower of Scotland” last night and cheering on the Scotland under 19′s in last night’s defeat to winners Spain. By your definition, myself and my pals of all religions were guilty of sectarianism last night. or is it specifically Irish Nationalism that you have the problem with? You see, we may be getting to the crux of the matter here.
“On Slugger within the last few weeks we had at least one nationalist poster who refused to condemn the burning down of an Orange hall, on the basis that the activities of the OO would attract crazy people from the other side. He claimed that while he didn’t support such burnings, he understood the situation – that there are those out there on the nationalist side who would attack Orange halls because of the antics of the OO.
I’d presume he would be of the same opinion in this case. If the GAA acts in this manner – supporting commemorations of IR terrorists – then that is going to attract the attention of crazy loyalists who will see the GAA as a legitimate target as a result.”
Posted by harpo on Jul 30, 2006 @ 04:23 PM
That poster was me Harpo, you have not misquoted me too much. Suffice to say that I did on many occassions condemn these arson attacks. I condemn any and all attacks, and certainly do not advocate attacks on anyone, clear. As far as crazy Loyalists attacking GAA buildings and members, that has already been done all too often. These self-same crazy Loyalists needed no excuse to kill Irish people of all hue’s, why would they bother with excuses all of a sudden?
Noticeably yourself and Bertie, aye good old Bertie are doing there utmost to excuse/defend Keith M’s comments. Incredible that Irish Nationalism should have to defend themselves from phantom allegations of sectarianism, when it is staring us straight in the face.
In answer to the question posed by Fair Deal.
The GAA has been a major benefactor from (UK) Lottery funding,provided via the NI Sports Council.
Lottery funding is subject to compliance with Equal Opportiunities, as stated in Clause 12, “Eligibility Criteria”
This states:
“Applicants will have to show that their rules and actions do not discriminate on the grounds of political opinion”.
The GAA practices sporting apartheid in Northern Ireland. It is wedded to a political idealology.
It’s rules were amended in 1979 to change from being “The Association shall be non political”, to it’s current position (Rule 8 a) of “The Association shall be non Party Political”.
This change allowed the GAA at Congress in 1979 to declare their “unequivocal support for the struggle for national liberation”.
In 1979, that “struggle” was an armed struggle.
It’s time for the lottery funding to stop.
Sectarian mass murderer, Bik McFarlane, was actively involved in the launch of this “commemoration” event.
The Antrim Board state they have “no issues” with the event.
The GAA = not a unionist about the place.
PE
Irish nationalism doesn’t have to defend itself against allegations of secatianism but you might. Prove that I would not have made the same points if it had been someone making the same points only exchanging KAC signs on flags and a nationalist saying it. That is what you nedd to do to get a charge of secarinaism to stick.
‘By your definition of sectarianism Harpo almost the whole world of Nationalism is sectarian.’
Prince:
Yes it is. That’s the problem with nationalism everywhere. That’s why is usually ends up with people like the Serbs acting upon their nationalism and digging mass graves.
‘Incredible that Irish Nationalism should have to defend themselves from phantom allegations of sectarianism, when it is staring us straight in the face.’
Indeed. The sectarianism of Irish nationalism is staring us all straight in the face.
In fact even that wouldn’t do it. I was being very unscientific there.
The charge is against the GAA. It is clearly secarian in terms of political outlook. That is not a big problem for me in itself. It seems a bit daft for a sports club but hey, so what. I do have a problem with comemorating terrorists and I am not sure that them getting public money can be justified.
“Indeed. The sectarianism of Irish nationalism is staring us all straight in the face.”
Where is it then Harpo, we don’t want a wish list, supposition or outright fantasy. Just good old fashioned evidence will do. The problem for Unionism is that they seem to focus all attention in talking shite, instead of dealing with the massive in-built problem of hating their fellow countrymen/women that they have.
Bertie.
“The charge is against the GAA. It is clearly secarian in terms of political outlook…..”
This is an organisation that seeks to promote and propogate Irish culture, it is not such a large leap to understand that those who are involved in the organisation are sympathetic to Nationalist political parties. So?
‘Membership
Membership of the Association shall be
granted only by a Club, and shall be governed
by the following regulations: -
(a) Full membership shall be open to all
persons of eighteen years or over who
subscribe to and undertake to further the
aims and objects of the Gaelic Athletic
Association, as stated in General Rules.’
This GAA rule thus excludes unionists.
Apartheid sport is what it is. Nationalist sport for nationalist people.
“problem for Unionism is that they seem to focus all attention in talking shite”
Of course this is completley without any secarianism.
If I had a similar mindset to PE, I would say that it is this was evidence of how secarian the average Irish nationlist is.
Harpo.
This post takes the biscuit. Go and have a lie down, it will make you feel better.
No maybe they should add a wee caveat, you know “further the aims of the GAA except for Unionists who can do what they like” heavens above.
“Apartheid sport is what it is. Nationalist sport for nationalist people”
They are a private Association, so they can be whatever they want to be.
Lottery funding to such a body must cease. The GAA is clearly in breach of the criteria for such funding.
Bertie.
Good example thanks.
‘Where is it then Harpo, we don’t want a wish list, supposition or outright fantasy. Just good old fashioned evidence will do.’
Prince:
Have you missed this whole thread? It’s all been about one strain of the sectarianism of Irish nationalism. The GAA and its apartheid sport. And that leads to tolerance of GAA clubs and people engaging in open support for IR terrorists.
Now I know that you and others respond with stuff like ‘but it isn’t sectarian’. But that is nonsense. It starts out being sectarian, and ends up supporting violence.
The GAA is set up to promote Irish nationalism. It starts out being nationalist, and that ends up with the open support for IR terrorism in certain parts of the GAA.
The trouble is that people like you will argue about what each and every thing means when nationalists do it, but I just apply the same standards as you apply to things like the OO. The big laugh is that you want the ‘different narrative’ to be understood when it comes to nationalism, but that’s just fancy dancing around the central issue. You will paint support for dead IR terrorists as being about ‘the honoured dead’ and while you are entitled to your view it’s nonsense.
If you support dead terrorists you support dead terrorists, no matter what you call them.
It’s a big fat double standard. Loyalists are terrorists, IRs are freedom fighters. The hunger strikers are the honoured dead, the Shankill Butchers are evil murderers.
I laugh when I read stuff on this thread. Nationalists all falling all over each other to try to avoid the obvious sectariansim that is in, or allowed by, the GAA.
The best one was the guy who said ‘so what?’ just after admitting that certain GAA people and clubs do support IR terrorism. He just didn’t get it, and never will. To him that is perfectly OK, and yet he would claim the GAA is open to all.
It has become apparent over the last few weeks on reading the posts here that the Republican movment has been hollowed out so much by Gerry Adams and Martin Magennis that it has no future. The only future and a tenuous one at that is for Sein Fein alone, the movement as a whole has ceased to have any meaningful role now it has disarmed. It therefore is looking for a role for itself to justify the last 80 odd years of its existence and at the same time trying to justify its past.
The Hunger Strikers Commemoration is one example where it is celebrating deaths which it iself caused when it had an offer on the table which would have saved all their lives, it is trying through CRJ to have a role and power in its communities. Is this what is left for it?
What exactly has the Republican movement achieved over the last 80 odd years? A UI is further away than ever and receeding ever faster, a parliament in Sormont has been accepted by SF, it also will accept the PSNI in the very near future when SF decide it is politically expedient to do so, the claim over the 6 counties is now gone etc. etc.
So except for a few cross border bodies and 3,000 + deaths what exactly has the Republican movement achieved for their dead volunteers and supporters?
I would really like to know what died in the wool Republicans see as their gains that would not have happened in any event during the 70′s, 80′s and 90′s without 30 years of killings and destruction.
GAA = KKK.
Apartheid organizations.
“problem for Unionism is that they seem to focus all attention in talking shite”
‘Talking shite’ of course meaning ‘exposing our sectarianism’.
Irish nationalists don’t have much of an argument if all they can say in response to open evidence of sectarianism is that unionists are ‘talking shite’.
‘This post takes the biscuit. Go and have a lie down, it will make you feel better.’
Prince:
Which one?
‘They are a private Association, so they can be whatever they want to be.’
Realist:
Of course they can. They could re-name themselves the Bobby Sands sports organization for all I care.
What they can’t do though in that case is claim to be non-sectarian.
The can put measures in place to exclude blacks and Jews too if they like. They already have anti-unionist measures in place.
Harpo.
No evidence then?
You could troll around for ever and never achieve much. Just loved you quoting the GAA rule book as evidence.
ROFL
you are a busted flush and I am bored with all the shite talk. Put up or shut up, enough wid da fantasy already!!!!!
‘Is this what is left for it?’
FD:
I think that is all that is left for it. Lowish-level agitation.
It’s pretty obvious that this stuff like getting the GAA to agree to let their grounds be used to commemorate dead IR terrorists is just the sort of shit that PSF/PIRA is reduced to. Anything that will stir up a bit more shit. The same goes for complaining abour B&Q uniforms.
One decade you are cheerleaders for the PIRA carrying out things like Teebane, the next you’re reduced to complaining about shop uniforms.
The sad thing though is when people take them seriously, like the so-called CRJ nonsense.
If you are into conspiracy theory, you could argue that trying to drag the GAA into their blindingly obvious sectarain nonsense is just what the evil Brits would want. So the evil Brits use their agents – Adams and McGuinness – to get their lackeys to do all sorts of stupid things.
“The can put measures in place to exclude blacks and Jews too if they like. They already have anti-unionist measures in place”
Harpo.
Oh, I know.
Their rules make that very clear.
[Play the ball, Eoghan - edited moderator]
‘No evidence then?’
Prince:
Did you miss what I said? The GAA is evidence of Irish nationalist sectarianism.
Apartheid sport. The Irish KKK at play.
The fact that the Antrim GAA has decided to allow a celebration of IR terrorists on one of its grounds is but one piece of evidence to show the sectarianism within Irish nationalism.
Are you saying that this story is a fantasy? Did someone make this story up, or did the GAA really do this?
Harpo.
Why is it sectarian to facilitate a hunger strike memorial? And is this your undeniable evidence? ROFL
Stop greetin about me calling you mad ya big woos, anyone reading your posts deduced that a long time ago;¬) it is only a bit of fun, or are your feelings so easily hurt?
Lighten up.
Moderater.
I was being light hearted, was that not obvious?
Eoghan
Play the ball. It’s a very simple rule. Blunt is fine, but keep it civil.
‘Why is it sectarian to facilitate a hunger strike memorial?’
Prince:
The very fact that you have to ask that is evidence of your inability to see sectarianism in anyone except your political opponents.
By doing so (facilitating a hunger strike memorial) you are excluding another sector of society. In this case, unionists and any others who don’t take to kindly to IR terrorism. That’s sectarianism.
Now you can waffle on about what the hunger-strikers were or weren’t, but they were IR terrorists – the whole lot of them. You can see them as honoured dead, but that’s a non-starter, just as it owul;d be a non-starter for someone to say that the Shankill Butchers were not terrorists.
How do you think unionists see the Antrim GAA in the light of various events? The allowing of naming of clubs after dead IR terrorists, the O’Neill’s shirt fiasco, and now this?
Do you think the Antrim GAA is providing an atmosphere of sport for all? Or just sport for nationalists.
Pete.
Modern referee’s like you are ruining the game.
It is a man’s/women’s game after all. If everyone squealed for a free kick everytime this happened, it would quickly turn into a continental type slugger.
Let the game flow man.
‘I was being light hearted, was that not obvious?’
Prince:
Here’s more of those nationalist double standards. If a unionist had said that he would be accused of various things, but if a nationalist says it, it’s all a bit of a lark, isn’t it? To the nationalist.
Harpo.
Stop whining, enough already.
“By doing so (facilitating a hunger strike memorial) you are excluding another sector of society. In this case, unionists and any others who don’t take to kindly to IR terrorism. That’s sectarianism.”
I believe that anyone who wishes to show up to this event is welcome Harpo, if you know different pray tell. If you and yours don’t like it don’t go, it’s a no-brainer really.
‘If everyone squealed for a free kick everytime this happened’
Prince:
I think your GAAism is showing. It may allow thuggery and rule bending, but soccer has clear rules. You played the man, and never went near the ball.
The fact that you say there shouldn’t even have been a free kick shows your attitude towards the rules. The request was for a card, not for a free kick. The free kick was obvious.
The free kick is given based on the facts – you played the man and not the ball. The card comes into it with respect to intention. You get a yellow if it is clear your intention all along was to play the man.
‘Stop whining, enough already.’
Prince:
So now you are reduced to asking me to stop whining?
Where’s your wanting to let the game flow now? LOL
Remember – one man’s whining is another man’s points that the person who is making the accusations of whining can’t handle.
In this case I think you can’t handle the material, so you are going after me instead. First the man not ball incident, and now you accuse me of whining.
Get over yourself. You just don’t like the GAA being exposed for what it is.
‘I believe that anyone who wishes to show up to this event is welcome Harpo, if you know different pray tell. If you and yours don’t like it don’t go’
So it’s like a KKK function then. If people don’t want to go because they don’t like it, that makes it OK? LOL.
You don’t actually address the point here, do you? You instead change the focus from my ‘it is an exclusionist event that excludes lots of people’ to ‘anyone who doesn’t want to go is free not to go’. A bit like the Nurnberg Rallies then, right? Jews wouldn’t have been to comfortable at them, but that’s OK, they were free not to go.
A pathetic response from you.
This event is sectarian. Unionists and others who aren’t into IR terorism won’t want to go because people who victimized them are to be commemorated there. It’s like saying there is nothing with an event to celebrate Hitler because even though those who fought him or suffered under his regime could go, they are free not to go.
I am sure that you believe everything you say Harpo, however saying it over and over won’t make it so for everyone else.
It is now painfully obvious that you also have no evidence to back up what you are repeating, until you do this how can you convince me of the veracity of your argument.
I await in earnest contemplation.
Considering the fact that Keoth has clarified his comments, one of the most telling one on here is that “so what”.
Sure what’s a bit of murder amongst sporting buddies?
harpo
You are doing a grand job!
PRINCE EOGHAN
There is no sectarian image, apart from in the minds of those seemingly orchestrating/participating in the campaign to have the GAA regarded as on a par with the sectarian OO.
Outside the nationalist community, there is a sectarian image. Bury your head in the sand and deny it if that makes you feel comfortable, but it is true.
Unionists certainly exclude themselves, many do not, but building up a GAA bogeyman that does not exist is a retrograde step. The thousands of young Protestants who play GAA especially in the 26 counties are not forced into it you know, and may well not feel offended by symbols of Irishness.
The GAA is a national organisation. By definition, unionists are excluded. The “thousands of young Protestants in the 26 counties” are unlikely to be unionists.
You give the game way, though, in your last sentence when you describe “symbols of Irishness”. This betrays the common nationalist arrogance of assuming that nationalism and Irishness are one and the same. They are not: Irishness embraces all identities in Ireland, including unionists.
A commemoration of a major part of Nationalist history cannot be at the beck and call of those who oppose Nationalism, often just for the sake of it. Nationalists do not go out of their way to offend anyone, not that there is anything in that culture that should offend. The sad irony is that only in their own land is their wholesale denigration of symbols of Irishness. The iconic hunger strikers will be in the memory long after all living memory of the Unionist imposed sectarian divisions are gone.
You merely reinforce the arguments of those who criticise the GAA. You do not even bother to deny that the GAA is nationalist! Clearly also you are a terrorist apologist.
PRINCE EOGHAN
This is an organisation that seeks to promote and propogate Irish culture, it is not such a large leap to understand that those who are involved in the organisation are sympathetic to Nationalist political parties.
So you have to be a nationalist to be interested in Irish culture? What kind of a thought process produces that kind of conclusion?
This kind of arrogant, chauvinistic attitude is a major barrier to reconciliation in Ireland.
I believe that anyone who wishes to show up to this event is welcome Harpo, if you know different pray tell. If you and yours don’t like it don’t go, it’s a no-brainer really.
Everyone was welcome to work in Shorts when the shop floor was festooned with Union flags, too. Isn’t that right?
Willow.
Much of what you say is quite correct. I have begun to make a fred mcmurray for the morra’s dinner so I will get back to you sometime later, ok.
‘You merely reinforce the arguments of those who criticise the GAA. You do not even bother to deny that the GAA is nationalist! Clearly also you are a terrorist apologist.
willowfield:
Good points.
Have you noticed the way that folks like Prince change any specific incident of nationalist sectarianism into the general cliche of ‘A commemoration of a major part of Nationalist history’. They don’t do this when it comes to the OO and the Shankill Butchers, do they? Oh no, in that case it’s a simple ‘the OO is commemorating loyalist terrorists’.
But here once again we have the old cliches trotted out. Instead of a commemoration of IR terrorists, it becomes ‘a major part of nationalist history’. It’s all rounded off and becomes general glib phrases. It’s not about terrorists, it’s about history.
I’d like to hear the reaction if OO supporters tried to say that those banners dedicated to various loyalist terrorists were to be comsidered ‘a major part of loyalist history’.
I must add though that if the 1981 hunger-strikers are a ‘major part of nationalist history’, then no wonder that Irish nationalism is such an ongoing failure.
‘Everyone was welcome to work in Shorts when the shop floor was festooned with Union flags, too. Isn’t that right?’
LOL
That’s about the height of his argument.
11:00am Dunville Gardens.
3:00pm Casement Park.
Thanks for the schedule for where 20,000 Irish Republicans are going to be that day.
But what are the marchers going to do for those 4 hours before the parade sets off?
That’s one hell of a lunch.
Hunger-strikers – lunch. Get it?
For clarity
The GAA is a national organisation.
should read
The GAA is a nationalist organisation.
Just as an aside.
Will this commemoration be for all 23 of the class of 1981 hunger-strikers, or just for the 10 graduates?
I read something a while back where one of the 13 failures is very scathing these days about Gerry and Martin. I don’t suppose he will be honoured, will he?
I’d say it will be all about those who are still on the good ship Provo. It certainly seems to be, since the likes of Mary Lou and that Ferris chick are going to be speaking.
Exactly what the hell was their experience of 1981? Mary Lou was 12 when skinny Bobby and the gang were dieting for Ireland. What’s she going to be able to add? The impact on pre-teen privileged Dubliners?
Was that Ferris chick even 1 when skinny Bobby died? What’s her view then? The impact of the hunger-strike on the infant children of PIRA terrorists in Kerry?
It’s all very sad. but obviously designed to show that these johnny-come-latelies to the good ship Provo can mouth the same platitudes as the veterans.
We’ve already seen that they can, and that their grasp of events doesn’t stand up to questioning. Like the Ferris chick who lost it and had no answers when questioned about the Garda McCabe murder. But all that won’t matter on August 13 – they’ll be up there with the worst of them. Telling everyone of how the men of 1981 ‘inspired us all’.
“the men of 1981′inspired us all’”
A sentiment which has echoed around the world. It does have a better ring to it than KAI but then that’s what’s driving unionists bananas. They’ve lost the argument and just now and then a little honesty slips out.