ONE of the most prominent figures of the Troubles, Mgr Denis Faul, has died. He was involved in the civil rights campaign, made an intervention in the hunger strike protest, criticised loyalist and republican violence and campaigned for victims of injustice, such as the Birmingham Six.
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Harry: Try to analyse, instead of parroting.
If you go back to the Civil war, entire areas were excommunicated, Cooley being a noteworthy one.
Faul was not Maynooth. He simply did not believe in violence, period. And, as I said, he and Sr Clarke et al stood up for the innocent in British jails (as a result of IRA killings) long before renta crowd got involved.
When were the Irish under the rule of priests?
You sound like a Home Rule is Rome rule parody. Time now to see the Greatv satan get booted out of the World Cup. A little off topic and due respects to Fr Faul but try these awful soccer jingles: http://tinyurl.com/qydre
Maybe the Brits are not the worst after all
Seanniee,
“Because law made by men and held up as gospel can be undone by another group of men”.
That is true. But it does not therefore prove he was talking rubbish. Tom Stoppard recently talked about the fact that rights do not exist independently of man: they have to be willed into existence.
In that respect, Faul was simply one of the ‘willing’.
Hi,
I would like to share my experience of Father Faul.
When I first came to NI the computer system 3702 at level 9 recorded Father Faul as being a member of PIRA.
Level 9 was a level accessed by all soldiers including UDR. The information at this level recorded sightings and low level Intelligence mostly collected from UDR Int Cells.
At level one( The highest). Father Faul in contrast was recorded as a Roman Catholic priest. Rather than being a IRA man or a Provo priest he was known to be critical of all sections of society. He was fierce in respect to the security forces but he was equally critical of the gangsters in his own community.
I met him once, a warm intelligent man who suffered no fools. A real loss to society.
Martin
Its amazing just because Dennis Faul said things that suited a certain section of opinion he is lauded as a great man.He was intolerant as regards mixed education.Just as the Catholic church is intolerant as regards condoms in Aids afflicted countrys.
If the Hunger Strikes that took place in the north of Irelands Maize prison in 1981 had not occurred, Fr Denis Fall’s biography and many of the quotes from those who are today singing his praise may well have been somewhat different. For there was little doubt up until that momentous event, most Unionists regarded Fr Fall as at best a troublesome priest, who had given succor and support to the Blanket-men during the years of their protest for political status; and plus by exposing the human rights abuses of the British army in the north of Ireland he had all but sided with the PIRA.
When the hunger strikes ended with the deaths of ten men, all this changed, as the prisoners and their supporters beyond the prison gate looked around for someone too blame for their defeat at the hands of Margaret Thatcher and the NI prison service. They alighted on the nearest non republican to hand, Denis Fall, who was a prison chaplain and being a friend of the families of many of the hunger strikers, he had advised them to put their sons first.
On seeing the scorn the Republican movement poured upon Fr Fall, many loyalists and leading Unionist politicians judged he cannot be all bad, on the pretext of my enemies enemy is my friend; and they changed their opinion of Fr Fall over night, reasoning if the Blanket-men hated him, it would do them no harm to say a good word about Fr Fall, the reverse perhaps. In the process totally misunderstanding the situation back then was far more complex than my enemies enemy is my friend.
Never the less to read the comments from some unionists on Fr Fall’s death, it seems the aforementioned misguided viewpoint’s about Denis Fall still prevail in some quarters. In reality he was firmly in the nationalist camp and defended the human rights of Republican prisoners the best he could under very difficult circumstances.
Thankfully the fury and bitterness many Blanket-men felt towards Fr Fall when the hunger Strikes ended has subsided somewhat, many of them realizing that although their rage in defeat was understandably, it was unfair to direct it at Denis Fall. This attitude is best summed up in the following quote from Anthony McIntyre a former Blanket-man, when I asked him his thoughts on Father Fall.
“I thought he did his best. We turned on him at the end of the hunger strike but it was unfair. He was great to us during the Blanket – some amount of tobacco came out of Denis’s shoes during the protest years for the boys”
Somehow I think Denis Fall would be pleased to hear McIntyres thoughts about him.
Defeat.You never learn.Just as in 1916 a so called defeat turned in to victory.Gerry and Martin would not be where they are today with Margaret Thactcher’s stupidity.
http://www.nuzhound.com/index.php
Nuzhound is beginning to stock up with adios Denis pieces. Daily Ireland blame him for the collapse of the hunger strike. What would have been gained by getting 10 more to die on hunger strike? Can the Provos tell the truth about anything?
Fact is, they went into the hunger strike with no strategy and got some very lucky breaks, mostly in the form of electoral victories. They lost the hunger strike, went downhill after than and eventually packed in the bombs and went after the ballot boxes. Faul had nothing to do with the defeat of the hunger strike.
Just as it is a good idea not to drag Hitler into arguments, maybe Thomas McSwiney should also be excluded. Usually the guy who lands the biggest punch wins. The big winners of the Troubles have been Big Ian, Gerry and Martin. The Brits also got their desired outcome. Faul was consistent throughout. The not a bomb, not a bullet mob were not.
Also, in 1981, they scrounged for support. Now, when those who followed them rot in dreary prison cells, what does Adams do? Complain (of course) he did not get an invite to a chic gig at the Victoria and Albert on the very day he went to a junket in Spain. What a w**ker!
Defeat.You never learn.Just as in 1916 a so called defeat turned in to victory.Gerry and Martin would not be where they are today
Posted by seanniee
seaniee
If i had a mind I could be nasty and say by your post you seem to agree with Richard O’Rawes analysis of the hunger Strike, I know you do not mean this, but perhaps you should be a bit more careful with your pen before you throw around insults, others might not be so kind.
What do you want me to do, lie, write the five demands were met and thus the hunger strike was called off before anyone died.
The fact is the hunger Strike was defeated, for if you do not believe the deaths of men like Bobby Sands, Frances Hughes and the others was a defeat then we differ on the meaning of the word.
Where you are correct is much good came out of the HS, not least it gave a massive confidence boost to the nationalist people in the north and those engaged in struggle around the world. As to the prisoners and there conditions, true after the HS their conditions improved markedly, but it is debatable wether these could have been attained after the forth death, but that is another matter for debate.
You mentioned 1916, which was another defeat, but you are correct that momentous change came about due to it. And as far as Adam’s and Co are concerned something similar happened after the HS.
However this does not mean that either events were not a major setback for Republicanism at the time, it simply shows that republicans were astute enough to recognize this fact and make the necessary changes within their strategy and tactics.
Only Stalinists and US presidents of the GW type demand that defeats are describes as victories, logical people deal with reality as it is; and try and turn defeat into future victories.
All the best.
While I didnt always agree with everything he said, the great thing about Fr Faul was that you could tell him you disagreed with him and he wouldnt hold it against you. As an Irish Republican I have witnessed a completely different view of Fr Faul since he came to our parish eight years ago. When he first arrived the local cumann of Sinn Fein were up in arms about his appointment due to his intervention in the ’81 hungerstrikes and his renounciation of the IRA. Shortly afterwards he was personally attacked for meeting with members of the PSNI, a number of parishioners tried to have him removed – but he stayed, and we were so much the better for his presence thereafter.
He was a great man of great personal courage and humility. He was so good to the disadvantaged and was very humble in his manner.
He will be badley missed by his parishioners in Termonmaguirc.
May you rest in peace
Interesting to compare the tributes of Ken Maginnis and Gerry Adams. Maginnis appears to be warm-hearted and generous and is certainly in the civilised tradition of remembering the best of people at the time of their passing. Adams, on the other hand, seems to spit out his grudging comments which amount to little more than Faul was not an SF Republican so his value was limited.